Where the hell are those kind of guys
Stop in for a cup of coffee
- Thread starter toolmanmike
- Start date
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Of course it did.....
Just go commando. Leave it out.Of course it did.....
Running across the desert in July, you want need all the cooling you can get. Needs a thermostat. IMO.
I'm sure I'm not the only guy to throw a beach towel on the seats and drive necked.Like the weather, it feels so nice out I think I'll leave it out.
dukeboy440
Well-Known Member
Wouldn’t the t state being out HELP with that?
As long as she's cute.....I'd get pulled over for a tail light out.
Nope. See, what the thermostat does, is to keep the coolant in the radiator till it cools off, By the fan and air flow. Without the thermostat, the coolant does not stay long enough in the radiator to cool off.... eventually it will over heat.....or not.....
dukeboy440
Well-Known Member
Only once way way back
Most likely engine will never reach operating temp. If it boiling hot out and your pushing the car, then yep stat is best left in.
We're is @krazykuda .
Hope your ok Karl.
Hope your ok Karl.
Unconventional
Well-Known Member
So I'm 17 and helping the guy up the street work on his USRC racing Midget
He tells me to pull the thermostat housing off. Off it comes and inside I find
.
Woody's Midget had an Enderle injected 215" all aluminum Olds V8 in it
Curtis chassis if I remember right.
His motor builder gave him a selection of those washers with different sized orifices for different race day temperatures.
The housing was o-ringed, 2 bolts smear a little grease on the o-ring change to the right washer, put it back together and watch the temp gauge during hot laps. Easy Peasy. At the time the USRC engine rules were pretty open 3.8L and normally aspirated was about it, made for a wide variety of kool racers 21 stud Flathead Fords to Crower V-4s
VW hair dryers were just making their presence known.
He tells me to pull the thermostat housing off. Off it comes and inside I find
Woody's Midget had an Enderle injected 215" all aluminum Olds V8 in it
Curtis chassis if I remember right.His motor builder gave him a selection of those washers with different sized orifices for different race day temperatures.
The housing was o-ringed, 2 bolts smear a little grease on the o-ring change to the right washer, put it back together and watch the temp gauge during hot laps. Easy Peasy. At the time the USRC engine rules were pretty open 3.8L and normally aspirated was about it, made for a wide variety of kool racers 21 stud Flathead Fords to Crower V-4s
VW hair dryers were just making their presence known.
I had a super cooling radiator built for the dart. 3 rows, 55 tubes per row. Wide as will fit, 22 inches. Copper.....And a 6 blade fan, milodon hi flow pump...
Milodon 16251 Water Pump Mechanical For SB Mopar 273/318/340 Steel 1960-1969
- Milodon’s exclusive high efficiency impeller design is installed into new GMB castings using heavy-duty bearings and large-diameter shafts. It is the impeller that makes the pump work so much better than a standard, stock design water pump.
- Milodon water pumps are available in high-volume (steel or aluminum) and standard-volume versions Pumps are direct factory replacements with ORG.MFR hose connections and bosses.
- These high-volume pumps have a balanced distribution design (equal flow to both sides of the engine block) and a high-efficiency impeller that increases coolant flow up to 30 percent over stock.
- These features increase coolant pressure in the block to prevent hot spots and air pockets and improve coolant flow in the radiator.
- A high-flow thermostat is recommended when using a high-volume pump.
MomsDuster
Well-Known Member
Here are a few excerpts from a conversation I was having with one of the great minds here on FABO. He had a very interesting view on cooling. Just going to throw it out here for y’all to read if you want.
And with that, coolant temps...this is a bit of a big deal. Too many guys think that 195 or 200 is better because their late model cars run that hot. For what we want, it’s a bad thing. The OE’s are more concerned with emissions than we ever need to be. And IMO, they are picking the pepper out of the fly poop. They do have to deal with getting the catalytic converters to light off quick and be efficient and higher engine temps help that. But it kills what we want.
On the dyno if you want to make some hero numbers you drop the coolant temp to 140 and make a pull. The HP a will go up...I’ve seen as much as 60 HP from 190 to 140. If its possible to get a street car to 140 it would make more power but you wouldn’t have a heater. And that sucks. So about 160 is as low as you can go and still get heat. Some guys still argue about coolant temps and power. They just don’t know.
It’s time to kill another dumb myth. I’m sure you’ve heard you don’t want the coolant moving too “fast” through the radiator because it won’t get cool enough and since the coolant isn’t in the radiator long enough, the engine overheats.
That is 100% bass ackwards. It it dead wrong. When you consider it, the longer the coolant is in the radiator, the longer it’s in the ENGINE! And while it’s in the engine, it’s picking up heat. So now, the coolant coming out of the engine is hotter so the radiator and fan have to do much more work to drop the coolant temp. Can you see the folly in that thinking?? It’s true but to some they will throw fists at you when you shatter their myth. It doesn’t make it less true.
The longer the coolant stays in the engine, the harder it is for the cooling system to drop the temp. That’s why some guys can’t run any compression on pump gas. They refuse to drop the coolant temp.
And to that end...as in dropping coolant temps...there are some things that have to be correct or the cooling system can’t control the engine temp like we want.
The first thing that has to be is a high flow water pump. That is mandatory. I use the Milodon high flow pumps, but I’ve seen the Flowkooler pumps and they are very nice. A quality high flow water pump is a MUST. You need coolant flow as much as you need air flow.
Next up....HA!...you thought I was going to say a big radiator!! I will say that but first you need...the correct pulleys. This is a must. The water pump MUST be overdriven. The water pump MUST turn faster than crank speed. If you look in a Chrysler Factory Service Manual you’ll see Chrysler knew it, because all the performance engines had overdriven water pump pulleys. You have to watch the aftermarket stuff because the lame brained fools SLOW the water pump down. The dumbest thing I’ve seen.
Chrysler scienced it all out for us. I’ve been driving MoPars since my first car, and if some guru or wannabe didn’t screw with it, they would never overheat. That’s because the water pump is overdriven.
So we have two of the three parts of a cooling system that will do the job and keep the engine temp where we want it, even driving through hells living room. A high flow pump and overdrive pulleys. Because coolant flow is everything.
The last piece is the radiator. It should be as big as you can fit in the chassis. Luckily, my car came with a 26 inch radiator. AFAIK, that’s the biggest radiator Chrysler used.
Ok, so the radiator is big. That’s not enough. It not only has to be big, it needs the proper number of cores. And that number is...TWO. And never more than TWO.
Don’t buy the marketing hype. More cores aren’t more better. Because two big cores will outflow 4 smaller cores. And we want FLOW, not hype.
My radiator has two 1 inch cores. I screwed up. If I had known about Cold Case radiators (a FABO sponsor BTW) I would have bought their radiator. It has two 1.25 inch cores.
Those big cores flow more coolant. And that’s what you want. You want the coolant in the block, grabbing some heat and then getting right out to the radiator to dump the heat and the do it all again. The longer it’s in the block the harder it is to keep the temp down.
Big coolant flow through a big radiator with big cores will cool an engine to whatever temp you want even on the hottest of days.
When you can control engine temp you can control detonation much better and run more compression when most guys can’t do it. The engine makes more power with more compression. It runs cleaner with more compression. And its more efficient with more compression.
And don’t forget a quality thermostat. I now only use the Stewart Components stuff.
And with that, coolant temps...this is a bit of a big deal. Too many guys think that 195 or 200 is better because their late model cars run that hot. For what we want, it’s a bad thing. The OE’s are more concerned with emissions than we ever need to be. And IMO, they are picking the pepper out of the fly poop. They do have to deal with getting the catalytic converters to light off quick and be efficient and higher engine temps help that. But it kills what we want.
On the dyno if you want to make some hero numbers you drop the coolant temp to 140 and make a pull. The HP a will go up...I’ve seen as much as 60 HP from 190 to 140. If its possible to get a street car to 140 it would make more power but you wouldn’t have a heater. And that sucks. So about 160 is as low as you can go and still get heat. Some guys still argue about coolant temps and power. They just don’t know.
It’s time to kill another dumb myth. I’m sure you’ve heard you don’t want the coolant moving too “fast” through the radiator because it won’t get cool enough and since the coolant isn’t in the radiator long enough, the engine overheats.
That is 100% bass ackwards. It it dead wrong. When you consider it, the longer the coolant is in the radiator, the longer it’s in the ENGINE! And while it’s in the engine, it’s picking up heat. So now, the coolant coming out of the engine is hotter so the radiator and fan have to do much more work to drop the coolant temp. Can you see the folly in that thinking?? It’s true but to some they will throw fists at you when you shatter their myth. It doesn’t make it less true.
The longer the coolant stays in the engine, the harder it is for the cooling system to drop the temp. That’s why some guys can’t run any compression on pump gas. They refuse to drop the coolant temp.
And to that end...as in dropping coolant temps...there are some things that have to be correct or the cooling system can’t control the engine temp like we want.
The first thing that has to be is a high flow water pump. That is mandatory. I use the Milodon high flow pumps, but I’ve seen the Flowkooler pumps and they are very nice. A quality high flow water pump is a MUST. You need coolant flow as much as you need air flow.
Next up....HA!...you thought I was going to say a big radiator!! I will say that but first you need...the correct pulleys. This is a must. The water pump MUST be overdriven. The water pump MUST turn faster than crank speed. If you look in a Chrysler Factory Service Manual you’ll see Chrysler knew it, because all the performance engines had overdriven water pump pulleys. You have to watch the aftermarket stuff because the lame brained fools SLOW the water pump down. The dumbest thing I’ve seen.
Chrysler scienced it all out for us. I’ve been driving MoPars since my first car, and if some guru or wannabe didn’t screw with it, they would never overheat. That’s because the water pump is overdriven.
So we have two of the three parts of a cooling system that will do the job and keep the engine temp where we want it, even driving through hells living room. A high flow pump and overdrive pulleys. Because coolant flow is everything.
The last piece is the radiator. It should be as big as you can fit in the chassis. Luckily, my car came with a 26 inch radiator. AFAIK, that’s the biggest radiator Chrysler used.
Ok, so the radiator is big. That’s not enough. It not only has to be big, it needs the proper number of cores. And that number is...TWO. And never more than TWO.
Don’t buy the marketing hype. More cores aren’t more better. Because two big cores will outflow 4 smaller cores. And we want FLOW, not hype.
My radiator has two 1 inch cores. I screwed up. If I had known about Cold Case radiators (a FABO sponsor BTW) I would have bought their radiator. It has two 1.25 inch cores.
Those big cores flow more coolant. And that’s what you want. You want the coolant in the block, grabbing some heat and then getting right out to the radiator to dump the heat and the do it all again. The longer it’s in the block the harder it is to keep the temp down.
Big coolant flow through a big radiator with big cores will cool an engine to whatever temp you want even on the hottest of days.
When you can control engine temp you can control detonation much better and run more compression when most guys can’t do it. The engine makes more power with more compression. It runs cleaner with more compression. And its more efficient with more compression.
And don’t forget a quality thermostat. I now only use the Stewart Components stuff.
Evening all. HBD Keith.
Some interesting thoughts here....thanks....
After all the money I spent on this car, I want the best radiator that will fit.....some research is due...
I basically agree, but for duribility need to get oil temps up near 212 F, and a t-stat around 180 F goes a long way toward that.
Race engines get fluid changes and complete teardowns far more frequenltly than street machines.
MomsDuster
Well-Known Member
For research purposes, this is the company I went with. Fair price, and it seems to be decent quality.Mopar Radiators | ECP and it’s been keeping my 440 happy.
MomsDuster
Well-Known Member
I run a 180 and my temps stay between 180-185 except on the 95+ days then she’ll flirt with 195-200 at idle in traffic. I’m ok with that.
Hell. I always expected to be pulled over for having outastate plates or just being a young male driver in a 'sports car'. Expecially down south, I made sure not to give them any other excuses. Some places have 'can't drive shirtless' rules. An open button down shirt always seemed like the best way to get some cooling without spending an afternoon in the cooler.
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