TD Canada Trust Bank stole from me - what would you do?

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slantsixdan

slantsixdan

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TD Canada Trust stole from me, and I'd like to cloudsource (sorry) some advice. For over a decade I've had a TD Visa card with TD Canada Trust, one of the major Canadian banks. Some months ago I was looking at my statement and saw they had charged me $45 for "Balance protection insurance" I'd never requested. I looked back through older statements and found they'd been charging me for over a year. Monthly amounts ranged from $30 to $120 or so. I called them up and they said I must've requested or authorised it, because it's an opt-in programme, so they'd pull their recording of the phone call in which I'd said "yes" and play it for me to remind me. That would take 4-8 weeks, so call back then.

I called at the 5-week mark: No, they hadn't retrieved the call yet, because it was such a long time ago. I must've said "yes" and just forgotten, because it's an opt-in programme and they're not allowed to add people to it without an explicit "yes", but as a courtesy they'll dig up the call and play it for me. Call back in a month.

I called yesterday: No, they hadn't retrieved the call yet, and weren't sure how long it would take because mine wasn't the only call in the queue waiting for retrieval (Oh, does that mean I'm not the only customer involuntarily opted in...?) but I should call again tomorrow (i.e., today) and speak with one of the two people who handles this kind of call.

I called today: Er...yes, they were able to retrieve the call. Er...yes, turns out I was right all along, I'd actually said "no". Er...they're very embarrassed and sorry. Er...this isn't how they normally do business. Er...they'll be issuing a full refund for premiums paid (just shy of $1K).

"With interest", I said.

"Er...well, that would...um...we don't usually...I mean...we don't know how much that would be...we'll have to look up the interest rate on the card."

Where we left it this morning is that they'll process the full premium refund immediately and I'll see it applied to my card within 5 days. Within 3 days, the responsible will call me back to discuss interest. Repeated apologies, "we're going to coach our people", etc.

Their utterances today -- all of them -- sound an awful lot like "Ohshît, we effed up and you caught us". Yes, they did. And yes, I did. I don't think they really expected me not to mention interest, and I think they might be hoping a magnanimous show of "agreeing" to pay interest will make me go away without pursuing this beyond "Hey! Give me back my money, you creeps!".

But the more I think about it, these people stole a thousand bucks from me. The fact it took me awhile to notice is immaterial; if I hadn't noticed, they'd've kept right on stealing from me in perpetuity. Also immaterial is their promise to give the money back in a week, three months after I noticed they were stealing it from me. It's still theft, just like if I absentmindedly walk out of a store holding a piece of merchandise I'd picked up off a shelf, it's still shoplifting even if I meant to pay—or even if I unilaterally decided a store employee had told me I could have it.

It occurs to me the interest rate on the card is somewhat less than relevant. That's the rate they set for when I borrow money from them, but what happened here is that they "borrowed" (stole) money from me. Which suggests that I should be the one determining the interest rate, and as far as I am concerned they're a bad risk.

Moreover, I'm not entirely sure money-back-with-interest is sufficient recompense. They outright stole my money and had the nerve to tell me I had told them to help themselves to it. What's to stop them doing it again? It's a pretty good gamble most people won't notice or have the time or energy to pursue restitution.

Please keep in mind this is Canada, not the United States. I don't think hiring a lawyer would be cost-effective because this is $1K we're talking about, not $10K. And I haven't looked at the credit card user agreement to see exactly how stacked against me it might be. So, here's where the advice part comes in: What would you do?
 
I would go into a local branch and talk to the ultimate supremo manager and discuss the details of your compensation considering they lied to you and stole from you and you have it all recorded on tape and you are starting a website and a facebook page for all the people who have had the same experiences, giving them a place to publicize the truth.
 
Had a Chase credit card.Someone jammed me for over $2,000 with multiple purchases made within minutes at the same electronics store in another state and place I had NEVER been too.I asked for a copy of their investigation but never received one.Only thing they sent me was information on credit card protection offered by them.Co-incidence? DON'T think so.
 
If you are interested in additional compensation, start soft, see what they offer, then if they refuse to budge finish by regaling them with how much publicity your new facebook page will get considering the viewer base on several websites you subscribe to.
 
Is there a TV station or newspaper that might be interested in hearing about the bank "scam" ?

I doubt they'd like the publicity :violent1:

Good Luck & I'd pursue it too........!!
 
Dan, I'm happy to hear they're making you whole on this one. I wouldn't think anyone would be entitled to more than they were out, however. I would move my money to another institution. You're right they were stealing & I wouldn't do business there any longer. But I'm not one to make a public outcry, I'm more of the take my money elswhere type.
 
I would look over my bill statements more closely from now on.

Yeah they might had "stole" from you but you can't do much about it, IMO

Look what the banks did in the USA, give out loans without verifying if the info was true, the banks ran up the home prices by issuing too many bad loans. There is people who paid $400,000 for a home and had to sell it 3 years later for around $200,000 and they lost all their deposit and money they paid each month for the loan and the bank claims they still owe them $$$$$$.

..........

I had Am Ex call me up a few weeks back asking if I charged $400 for a Dell Computer, ah no I said. They explain to me that there has been a rash of bad charges going around and that is how they found out about it and there was a few other bad charges on my card...OK, well thanks I was like and I ask what I owed and that was right.

So I ask if I'm getting a new card with different numbers, oh certainly but can you verify your home address...I was like NO, cause you are calling me and I got no idea if you really are from Am Ex..in fact that was my first response when I first stated talking to them. So I told them I call you back from the number on back of my credit card, which I did. They answered my call by saying this is Am Ex credit card protection service can I have your name, which I gave them. I was told that they are very busy right now and to call back in a few hours ??? Huh, I was like OK and never called them back.

I never got my new card and when my bill came in the mail it was correct and I seen no charges removed. I have yet to use my Am Ex card since then.

I believe what happen is they try to get you to give out your personal info and then tell you, see, you need our protection service cause no matter how good they are, the hackers are one step ahead of them...that is what they told me about the Dell computer charge.


.............

A $1,000 is alot of charges, I be happy just to have the money back if I was you...go throw yourself a party, ha ha and again READ your billing statements each and every month.
 
Good luck suing the banks, they spend more on lawyers then we could ever dream of. Frankly I'm surprise your getting $1,000 back, how many years has they been taking a fee out of your account ?

I got a feeling some banks, say Bank of America would had laugh and hung up on you
 
I'm looking at my Chase credit card bill right now...boy does it have the fine print on the back of the statement...

I see this....

What to do if you think you found a mistake on your statement ?

If you think there is an error on your statement,write to us at xxxxxxx

In your letter give us the following information

*Account info, Your name and account number
*Dollar amount. The dollar amount of the suspected error
* Description of the problem, if you think there is an error on your bill, describe what you believe is wrong and why you believe there is a mistake.

you must contact us within 60 days after the error appeared on your statement

..............

Man this is too long to write all down, it take up the whole page lol.....I would just be super happy your getting $1,000 back, IMO..the US banks would not be as fair or friendly..heck they might sue you for harassing them, ha ha
 
Class action suit....if possible.... The lawyers get all the dough... But it keeps companies from doing exactly what they did to you and others.

Good luck Dan.
 
I'd wager that one bank spends more money on lawyers than all of us combined spend on anything to do with cars.

Take your money to a different institution, and tell anyone that will listen, what happened (after you find out if you will get any recompensation).

Unfortunately, short of the afore mentioned media involvement and class action suit, that's about all there is to do.
 
Dan, In a situation like this, I prefer to let my money do the talking. Once they cut your check and make you whole, empty the accounts and move on. When the banking system ate itself, all of my money left Wells Fargo and went to a local credit union. Now, I'll be the first to admit that the credit union doesn't have a convenient local branch, but between full service ATMs and online banking I have had no issues accessing my money, and I have never been charged any sort of a fee.

Jason
 
Geeezus Kaaariest. Quick bawling, cash the check, close your account, and move on down the road. Be damn happy they decided to refund your money. Many banks disallow problems if not brought to their attention in 60/90 days. This also includes other business credit like power and the phone companies.

slantsixdan said:
then 67Dart273 shocks us all with the breaking news that he doesn't like me,
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I have a ONE dollar bill with Chase Manhatten which they refuse to release. I claim I don't owe it, they claim I do, and they won't close the account, which means it's vulnerable to piracy and theft. They must have spend hundreds of dollars of labor time arguing with me over this issue. I'd LOVE to close this account and tell CM to 'eff off.
 
well you got your moneyback, it could have been worse. Did they steal it, yes...happen all the time in business. Sue....nah, get over it, ya got took (luckily not that bad) , switch banks and move on
 
first talk to crown and the provincial finance minister about a continueing conspiracy to commit fraud then send the bank a written demand for payment of penalties and interest compounded monthly from the earliest charge at the maximum allowable { it was like 49%an but I think it got reduced when they went after the payday loan guys } interest rate , then since it will probably be less than the cap for small claims sue them there , they don't allow lawyers and when the bank fails to show the judge will order in your favour by default and may agree to refer the facts to the crown for criminal revue .
PS get all your money out first of course . and remember sueing and collecting are 2 completely different things but you can at least use the court order to shame them publicly and file liens against their assets that will affect there corporate profile .
 
I would hold my breath until the money was credited back to my card. Then I would pay the card off and close that account. The reason I would hold my breath is if this issue lands on legals desk you will probably not get anything. Each charge was clearly stated on your monthly billing statement. If the charge was not authorized you only have so many days to notify them. That means that you were negligent as well. It is my opinion that they would rather spend tens of thousands of dollars on legal fees than set a precedent for other customers to demand full and complete refunds plus interest for charges over 90 days old. Good luck!
~Michael
 
Canada is a lot stricter with Cards and Credit than the US { which is why we're doing ok and your economy bricked } get your money close your accounts and then give em hell Dan .
 
If they got $1,000 from you how many more people have they ripped off. It could easily be 1,000,000s of dollars. These type of companies need to be held accountable and lawyers take these cases on a contingency basis.

It just took one person to get the TransUnion class action lawsuit started. The credit reporting agency screwed over a lot of people and ended up paying the price in real money. Money and the bad publicity are the only things that will get companies to act right. I was in on the first round of the settlement and my wife was in the second batch.
 
First of all, go over your statement every month and check all transactions. As others have stated, once you get your money back, close the account and switch banks. I'd also try contacting a Provincial Ombudsman about the matter. Maybe they can put additional pressure on the bank. Good luck with it.


Wylde1.
 
I have been banker for 36 years and believe me TD does not want this situation to go without being corrected. I did not work for TD, but believe me banks want to do the right thing by their customers. Without customers, banks or any busines cannot exist.

You have options. They have admitted their mistake and you deserve restituiton.

Full premiums paid plus interest chardged +a reasonable amount of interest you could have earned had you invested the premiuns paid plus interest charged in an investment at a reasonable rate today ( Ing bank at 2% to a stock investment at 12%, so say an average of 7% ) and you would be in a realistic range. Most banks would offer alittle more to show good faith.

Speak to the bank managerno results than ask to speak to the VP (bank manager`s boss), if no luck the bank`s ombudsman and finally the Fed`s ombudsman. The manager never want`s it to go beyond him or her in an instance such as this. PM me if you want some more help. You deserve better than this and TD really would like the opportunity to fix this.
 
Saetun said:
Dan, I'm happy to hear they're making you whole on this one. I wouldn't think anyone would be entitled to more than they were out, however. I would move my money to another institution. You're right they were stealing & I wouldn't do business there any longer. But I'm not one to make a public outcry, I'm more of the take my money elswhere type.

In another post to this thread I alluded to the fact I was a a banker for over 36 years. Trust me the bank was not stealing from a customer. Somewhere along the way an employee decided that Dan was a good insurance prospect and obvisously decided to include insurance on his line credit/credit card without his knowledge or authorization. This employee has goals and targets, including one for insurance sales. They took advantage of the situstion and added insurance to an account that Dan did not authorize and got a good or better raise for this dishonest conduct. Banks do not condone this behaviour and fire people for a breach of conduct. That is what this is. The bank want's and will do right by Dan. Give them a chance. Things can be made right and by learning from mistakes they can put proper controls and training in place to avoid such issues in the future.

Dan deserves restitution and the TD Bank, given the chance will do right by him. It happens in most business, give them a chance,
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