Tranny removal. Stuck!

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wheelman21

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Hey guys. I need some veteran assistance. I'm trying to remove the 727 behind my 340 in my 73 dart sport. I'm very mechanically inclined. I work in a European speed shop. But this is my first time pulling this trans away from this motor in this car. The trans is split from the motor and free of any mounts etc, but it's hung up. I can't get enough clearance or something. I've got the motor tipped back as far as I can go without removing the dizzy. The bell housing is hitting the tunnel and the input shaft is still hung up in the converter. Pardon my ignorance on this, it's far from my specialty. Is there some tip or trick or something I've missed? The trans is in neutral. Should it have been jn park or something? Any tips would be helpful! Thanks!
 
This is probably a dumb question, but i've done this; are the flexplate bolts undone? there shpuld be 4 on the flexplate.
 
Please do NOT pull an automatic......at least Mopar autos.......and leave the converter on the engine. This is a quick way to damage the pump, etc in the transmission. You simply unbolt the flex plate before you pull it and leave the converter in the trans. In fact, it's a good idea to use some meanse, wire, a simple bracket, etc, to retain the converter so it doesn't fall out.
 
Sounds like you didn't loosen the converter bolts. Also, there is no 'flywheel' in an automatic, just a 'flexplate'. The flexplate attaches the converter on the outer ears and is bolted to the crank flange on the inside.

Put two bolts back in the bell and bolt it back up to the motor. Once it's back into place then undo the the converter bolts. ALWAYS do the converter bolts first or you end up in the situation you are in.

You have to spin the motor over with a breaker bar to rotate the bolts around. Take a look when you get the bolts out, there is usually one oblong hole, just make sure you remember where it is when you put the trans back in.

When you are trying to loosen the converter bolts, make sure the motor can not rotate backwards, put a prybar in the converter teeth to keep it from rotating. Converter bolts can be a pain to loosen, they round off easily.

Also, support the back of the engine with a block of wood under the pan.

Holla back if you need more help.
 
if you were pulling the motor... you would end up with this - the four flex plate attachment points are easy to see -

(jackass am I.. I just did this last week and it didn't even cross my mind when I read the OP)
 

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Well aren't I embarrassed. You guys nailed it. What a complete rookie bonehead move on my end. I built this car 5 years ago when I knew a lot less about working on cars. I should know better! Thanks for the great answers guys!
 
Funny how that worked...transmission comes out a lot easier when you unbolt the converter. It's out and now the real work begins...the 5 speed conversion.
 
wheelman21 said:
Funny how that worked...transmission comes out a lot easier when you unbolt the converter.
Click to expand...

#-o

We've all been there. I used to remove/install transmissions daily, there's always something that can trip you up and ruin your day.
 
67Dart273 said:
Please do NOT pull an automatic......at least Mopar autos.......and leave the converter on the engine. This is a quick way to damage the pump, etc in the transmission.
Click to expand...

There's a good chance that it is already to late.
(converter part way out and trans moved, pulled and twisted)
A good converter snout, pump gears and sealing areas inspection is in order
 
He's converting to a 5 speed, so he may not care about its condition. Tell us more about the 5 speed conversion.
 
My neighbor's son in law put a rebuilt four whanger into his late model CJ. When he was pulling the engine I happened over there, they were all hung up. Left the converter on the engine, and left the dust shield on the transmission, LOL

Del!!! Why won't this come loose?!! LOL
 
Well I'm hoping to sell the 727 since it was built for drag according to the guy I bought it from. But we've all heard that before. It's got a B&M flex plate so they did something half way decent. It looks like this may have been a 4-speed engine at one point as it has a pilot bushing in the crank. None the less I'll give the transmission a good inspection.

As far as the 5 speed goes Im using an ax-15. I can't afford a mopar 4 speed OD or a Tremec, so this will have to do. I've got everything lined up its just a matter of modifying the tunnel and figuring out the clutch pedal. I was planning to use a wilwood pedal and master but the firewall isn't as smooth as I was hope so we will see. But the big thing is modifying the tunnel. As much as I hate to do it, I hate automatics even more.
 
wheelman21 said:
I hate automatics even more.
Click to expand...

You should change your thinkin'

I finally did. Most of my life I've always preferred stick boxes, but now I'm old and can't row around a big shifter and clutch.

I have a reverse MVB 727 and I just love it. I'm thinking of putting together a 42RE (A904 based otherwise known as an A500) OD automatic. It DOES require some crossmember work, but not cutting up the floor. Putting in the larger 727 based (A518) OD would require serious floor tunnel work.

If these are built right they are fun to drive.
 
wheelman21 said:
As far as the 5 speed goes Im using an ax-15.
Click to expand...

I'm sue I'll get arguments telling me I'm wrong but the AX15 is a piece of **** transmission. You could not pay me to put one of those in my car or any car for that matter. They were hateful in Wranglers, would make life totally depressing in a muscle-era Mopar. Sorry for the rant, they're just not that great. Mopar did not sell many of them.

wheelman21 said:
I can't afford a mopar 4 speed OD
Click to expand...

Really? Are you referring to the Passon unit or a factory one? The OE ones are actually fairly inexpensive since most guys don't want 'em. I got mine for $100. There are way more out there than AX15s. I see them for under $300 routinely. IMO, you would be better off finding one of them, even if it needs to be rebuilt.

Additionally, most hydraulic clutch actuator systems available that retro fit into older cars are big bucks, like $400 +. I just looked them up the other day for my own transmission quagmire.

As you know already, there's a lot of fab work/alterations involved with this deal which always equates to more cost than anticipated. A factory unit bolts in with basically no mods except for a floor hump which are available in fiberglass for cheap.

Be aware also that the AX 15 is a 'top loader' type of trans so measure twice before you start cutting to make sure that long shifter handle winds up in a reasonable location and does not hit the dash. What bell hosing are you using?

Also, what would you do for a mount? In the cross member in your car in the right spot? Is your current driveshaft going to bolt up or do you need to figure out a wacky slip yoke to mate to the shaft? Seems like more of a hassle and ultimately more expensive to put a late model Jeep trans into an A body, even if the trans was free.

Sorry to rain on your parade, I realize you didn't ask for opinions but if you're asking for help to begin with I might as well try to steer you away from more misery. Good luck with whatever you choose to do.
 
wheelman21 said:
As far as the 5 speed goes Im using an ax-15.
Click to expand...

I'm sue I'll get arguments telling me I'm wrong but the AX15 is a piece of **** transmission. You could not pay me to put one of those in my car or any car for that matter. They were hateful in Wranglers, would make life totally depressing in a muscle-era Mopar. Sorry for the rant, they're just not that great. Mopar did not sell many of them.

wheelman21 said:
I can't afford a mopar 4 speed OD
Click to expand...

Really? Are you referring to the Passon unit or a factory one? The OE ones are actually fairly inexpensive since most guys don't want 'em. I got mine for $100. There are way more out there than AX15s. I see them for under $300 routinely. IMO, you would be better off finding one of them, even if it needs to be rebuilt.

Additionally, most hydraulic clutch actuator systems available that retro fit into older cars are big bucks, like $400 +. I just looked them up the other day for my own transmission quagmire.

As you know already, there's a lot of fab work/alterations involved with this deal which always equates to more cost than anticipated. A factory unit bolts in with basically no mods except for a floor hump which are available in fiberglass for cheap.

Be aware also that the AX 15 is a 'top loader' type of trans so measure twice before you start cutting to make sure that long shifter handle winds up in a reasonable location and does not hit the dash. What bell hosing are you using?

Also, what would you do for a mount? In the cross member in your car in the right spot? Is your current driveshaft going to bolt up or do you need to figure out a wacky slip yoke to mate to the shaft? Seems like more of a hassle and ultimately more expensive to put a late model Jeep trans into an A body, even if the trans was free.

And oh yeah, pretty sure the AX 15 only came behind the 4.0/258 if I'm not mistaken. What combination of things are you working with here? What car is this going in?

Sorry to rain on your parade, I realize you didn't ask for opinions but if you're asking for help to begin with I might as well try to steer you away from more misery. Good luck with whatever you choose to do.
 
Well my ax-15 isn't from a jeep. It's an Asin Warner bell. It came from a 4.0 Dakota. It bolts directly to the 340. There's a couple of guys on here running them that really like them. As far as the pedal and hydraulics are concerned Im planning to use a wilwood pedal and master since I'm a dealer for them. Southbend has agreed to put a clutch setup together for me, as I deal for them too. A little tunnel fab is no big deal. I've been shaping and doing metal fab since middle school.

If you can find me a factory 4 speed OD for $100 sign me up. Even at twice that price!
 
wheelman21 said:
Well my ax-15 isn't from a jeep. It's an Asin Warner bell. It came from a 4.0 Dakota. It bolts directly to the 340. There's a couple of guys on here running them that really like them.
Click to expand...


4.0 Dakota? No such animal AFAIK. Maybe it's 3.9 V6? That would be the only platform that would share a bell pattern with a 318/340 block since the 3.9 was cut-down 318. The starter on a small block is on the driver's side. A 4.0 starter is on the passenger side.

What engine are you working with? Might help to clarify things.

Anyway, Jeep, Dakota, Cherokee, same thing pretty much. 90's - early 00's Chrysler 6 cylinder variant-powered light to medium duty vehicles. Nothing performance about any of it. The V8 Daks had an NV3500 which is a sightly beefier unit.

I see there is a Hurst shifter for the AX 15 so I guess there is some interest in them. They are not unreliable or anything, to me they just suck to drive. The OE shifter was long and wobbly, the gear ratios are wide, they were noisy... NO way would I put one behind a 340 for any reason whatsoever, what a complete waste. Not worth the effort IMO.

Sell it to a Jeep guy and hold out for an 833. Or, ignore me and do what you're gonna do.
 
side questions ??
why not pull an auto in an A body ??
isn't easier to pull motor with trans attached ??
 
jazak5 said:
side questions ??
why not pull an auto in an A body ??
isn't easier to pull motor with trans attached ??
Click to expand...
JMO - I don't think so - getting just the engine out is a piece of cake - taking the trans with it isn't really all that much more difficult, but why do if you don't have..? With that said, if it were the trans I was after, I would seriously consider pulling the engine too.. the "problem" with pulling just the trans is having enough room under the car - for those of us that don't have a lift that is.
 
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