stroked340
Well-Known Member
No i don't use iron heads..
Portwork $300.00
11.02
no dyno numbers only numbers that matter are time slips..
Which heads to get?
- Thread starter couper 340
- Start date
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No i don't use iron heads..
Portwork $300.00
11.02
no dyno numbers only numbers that matter are time slips..
DakotaDuster
"I'm all in."
I asked because everything I've read(which is admittly not a lot) about Edlebrock heads inparticular was that you need to put a lot of money into them it seems. So I was curious aside from the weight difference why you couldn't put the same money into steel heads and have similar performance. Thanks for the info and input guys.
mph is 98 to 102 with these gears.
lilredrooster
Active Member
G`day Evan,
I for one would be very interested in your opinions, I am sure there would be many others too.....
Very sad that you feel bashed into with-holding your comments.....
Happy to hear and share all opinions, after all isn`t that the purpose of having a forum.....
Grrrreat thread and a very common and current topic, thanks to all for contributing....
What's that you say... LOL
Back to more important and relevant matters.
OP your car has something WAY off too run that MPH with what you say is in the engine.
Hey stroked 340, where did you get heads ported for $300.00? The cheapest i found in Maryland is $800.00 to $1500.00
To the OP;
As said before, purchase what fits the wallet. What's the cost savings over the Edelbrock heads? You could put that into some bowl work. A better fatter higher flowing port at low lift. (Under .500)
Stock heads can do 400HP.
At 9.5-1, there's almost no cam you can't run considering you did say street right? I think you mis understood Hughes and that they were saying that would be the least amount of cam. THAT, I can understand. To much compression on a small cam sucks. Better off the other way around. To much cam and not enough compression.
As said before, purchase what fits the wallet. What's the cost savings over the Edelbrock heads? You could put that into some bowl work. A better fatter higher flowing port at low lift. (Under .500)
Stock heads can do 400HP.
At 9.5-1, there's almost no cam you can't run considering you did say street right? I think you mis understood Hughes and that they were saying that would be the least amount of cam. THAT, I can understand. To much compression on a small cam sucks. Better off the other way around. To much cam and not enough compression.
Incorrect. Having a machinist check it out is considered a good thing by some. I ran mine OOTB without issue. I have zero dollars into my heads after I opened the box and run them into the low 12's.
You can run low 12's with stock 2.02 heads. It's all combo dependent.
You mention, well, since you may have a set of good 308's or an X or J set, what would you get from spending the cost of an Edelbrock head on the OE iron head? A lot, but probably not as much as a ported Edelbrock would flow, but for surely better than a OOTB Edelbrock head.
The problem is the ceiling on OE iron heads. They flow only so well. And an aftermarket head will flow better when the same amount of porting is applied. But the ported OE head will out flow the OOTB head every time.
The current Edelbrock price is somewhere around $1500 for the pair.
That's a whole lotta porting that can get done here!
He said ported? He did say work into them. At $300, it sounds like a valve job and base clean up.
more compression need more dur cam and less compression less duration ? ive read 250 dur @50 and up is to high for what 9.5 compression i have with this gearing.
To be a good match, I agree.
I'm running a 27 inch tires, 4.10/4spd with a [email protected] cam. I could use more gear. But it isn't like it is in liveable. The lower the gear the longer you wait to get into the power band to get going.
There is a wide bracket in which any cam can operate in and work well. Going beyond that can cause issues with the engines operation. Or how well it operates. (This is how Edelbrock came up with there matched power packages. A great gimmick that makes sense.)
To much compression, 12-1, with a RV cam, like a [email protected] will require an octane of way to much for a street driver and most wallets. On the flip side, a 7.5-1 ratio and a nice drags cam of let's say, [email protected] makes the engine feel like garbage. These two examples show a gross mis match of parts put together outside of there operating perameters. You want to balance the whole package.
With 3.73 gears, the expected "Performance" engine package would expect to see a cams range in a certain bracketed rpm range. It is more of a waste to use a cam like [email protected] with these tears and actually expect a great performing engine. Like wise, a cam of [email protected]+ would also be on the outside of the bracket. This doesn't mean it can not be used but the effective and balanced package will not go outside the bracket of best suited parts to use for it.
It's all about the balance of the engine for its intended usage.
I'm running a 27 inch tires, 4.10/4spd with a [email protected] cam. I could use more gear. But it isn't like it is in liveable. The lower the gear the longer you wait to get into the power band to get going.
There is a wide bracket in which any cam can operate in and work well. Going beyond that can cause issues with the engines operation. Or how well it operates. (This is how Edelbrock came up with there matched power packages. A great gimmick that makes sense.)
To much compression, 12-1, with a RV cam, like a [email protected] will require an octane of way to much for a street driver and most wallets. On the flip side, a 7.5-1 ratio and a nice drags cam of let's say, [email protected] makes the engine feel like garbage. These two examples show a gross mis match of parts put together outside of there operating perameters. You want to balance the whole package.
With 3.73 gears, the expected "Performance" engine package would expect to see a cams range in a certain bracketed rpm range. It is more of a waste to use a cam like [email protected] with these tears and actually expect a great performing engine. Like wise, a cam of [email protected]+ would also be on the outside of the bracket. This doesn't mean it can not be used but the effective and balanced package will not go outside the bracket of best suited parts to use for it.
It's all about the balance of the engine for its intended usage.
Here's a weird thought I mention from time to time. The Dodge truck racing series has to have a compression ratio of 9.0-1 but yet make over 750 HP. Now before I ask if you think that is streetable, we all understand streetable is a person to person opinion on what is and isn't tolerable.
Is that a streetable engine and can it be so in your car?
Is that a streetable engine and can it be so in your car?
magnummopar
Well-Known Member
11.02 is quick, our local track champ that is running a super fast early fish runs 10.80.
This is a list of his build including his "door stop" heads
318/375 CID basic engine specs:
3.970 Bore 318 +.060
3.79 stroke Callies Crank
Callies Rods
Diamond 13.4:1 Pistons, tool steel pins and rings
EQ/FBO Stage 3 Race Heads
REV 2.00/1.60 SS Race Valves
Schubeck flat tappet solid lifters
Smith Brothers push rods
Racer Brown 1.6/1.5 Magnum roller rocker system
Racer Brown STX 20 Cam 267 at 50, 576/540 lift
Cometic head gaskets
FBO Ignition System
Race Demon 775 Carburetor
M-1 Mopar Magnum intake
Aerospace Components Ultra 350 GPH fuel pump.
You might have heard of him, a company called FBO, right up the road from us.
If you can run 11 with a 360 and $300 of Edelbrock port work, you might want to give him a call and help him set up his car because if his 550-600 HP Doorstop Head engine will only go a few thou faster than yours, he must have left the emergency brake on. I smell something funny here.
moparcrazy
Well-Known Member
well here's one reason to go for Edelbrock Heads... 35% Discount in forum of a gift card
http://www.autozone.com/engine/cylinder-head-performance?filterByKeyWord=head&fromString=search
http://www.autozone.com/engine/cylinder-head-performance?filterByKeyWord=head&fromString=search
magnummopar
Well-Known Member
In our experience, the Edelbrock heads hold up well in stock to mild form, no long term on radical porting but thats not the topic. They do however need a valve job or at least complete disassemble to check guide clearance. I have seen several sets that didnt need anything but have also seen sets that were crap. I got burned 2 x before I learned to check them first.
If you charge your customer $1500 plus gaskets and labor to install them and within 50 miles the engine smokes like a burnt /6 , you get kind of pissed... When said company tells you to go F yourself your get more pissed. Other than some machining mistakes (est 30-50%)the heads themselves are good, its the company that sucks. Customer service is ****.
EQ will bolt right on and work great to just over 400HP, possibly more, no problems. If you do port work, they will easily work to 500 hp. Probably the cheapest 500 hp you will get. As demonstrated by Don, he has them working to 600 hp.
We build mostly 350-450 hp engines that are either A body or Wrangler bound. Real world vehicles that are driven daily. Thats what our customers want and we dont argue. For what we do, the EQ heads work very well and are cheaper than the other heads available. Probaby the same logic to us selling reground rollers for $199 5-1 over our billet roller for $399...also, everything we build is injected.
magnummopar
Well-Known Member
Another vote for EQ's....
Hey magnum mopar thanks for posting Don Gould build !!
I have talked to several times and done business with him.
He is a great guy and knows mopars,carbs,ignitions,racing.....
Hey magnum mopar thanks for posting Don Gould build !!
I have talked to several times and done business with him.
He is a great guy and knows mopars,carbs,ignitions,racing.....
Don is a cool guy sells great products and knows a lot !!
I do not think that car makes 550- 600 hp though ?
It runs well !!
If he was making 550- 600 hp with his knowledge that car would be much faster !!
Not knocking the car or Don !!
Just sayin !!
Carry on
Eq's for the money are great !!!
I still say long run and porting the aluminum heads win !!'
Out of the box eq's or rhs .
magnummopar
Well-Known Member
Don is the nicest guy ever. Great engine builder too. His build is public knowledge, at least what he is willing to tell you is. As with anything, there is a certain amount of "trade secret" stuff that takes years to figure out. Thats what the money you pay him is for, knowledge...its the one thing Summit and Jegs cant sell. Nor the Chinese. Believe me, with a few exceptions, the big guys can starve out independent shops with super sales, lost leaders etc easily. We are fortunate that we are a small niche business or we would have gone the way of the dinosaur long ago. Having the knowledge of Wrangler Magnum swaps and A body FI swaps is what keeps us alive. Knowing the magnum in and out helps us beat Jegs and Summit on stuff they dont know how to sell. They can sell EQ but dont have the other parts easily available. Funny thing, we can actually beat their prices on EQ heads , radiators and things they dont give away to attract sales. Its getting tougher all the time. Lots of 14 hr days over the last 20 years....maybe too many.
magnummopar
Well-Known Member
From Dons site
http://www.4secondsflat.com/FBo_EQ Cylinder heads.htm
He says" 550 + HP"
also from his site
We've spent months on the flow bench with different valve sizes and degree's of port work to determine what total combination works best, we have the formula and the parts list to get everything right.
We offer these heads in 3 stages, from a much improved stock replacement to an all out bracket package for your 318 to a 416 stroker. We've tested several cams, valve sizes and rocker ratio combo's, tell us what your trying to accomplish and we'll build you a top end package from pushrods to carburetor that will maximize your combination to the fullest. We know what works!
IMO This is an Awesome head, we're making over 600HP with our 318/375 mule and it runs consistently within a couple of hundredths of a second on any given day. They're absolutely the best cylinder head you can bolt on to your small block Mopar if you want Maximum Power, Reliability, Consistency, Durability and you want to Win Races.
You cut the light these heads will make the power.
In 2008 we'll be running a 400" combination and fully expect to be deep into the mid 10's, same heads, same ET Slayer Cam, same ET Slayer Carb.....just a little Iron Headed SB Mopar, kickin' Big Block butts all over the race track.
The Formula.....
I'll give you the basics but we're not going to publish everything we do to make these heads work:
CnC ported intake and exhaust 2 available stages
1.94/1.60 valves in a specific length
Our Special CnC mounting track for the rocker arms to allow for taller valves and springs
Open the spring pockets to allow for a larger diameter spring
Surface the heads to RA 50 for FBO Spec Cometic MLS Gaskets"
I would seriously doubt he would post 600 hp on his site if he didnt have the **** to back it up.
http://www.4secondsflat.com/FBo_EQ Cylinder heads.htm
He says" 550 + HP"
also from his site
We've spent months on the flow bench with different valve sizes and degree's of port work to determine what total combination works best, we have the formula and the parts list to get everything right.
We offer these heads in 3 stages, from a much improved stock replacement to an all out bracket package for your 318 to a 416 stroker. We've tested several cams, valve sizes and rocker ratio combo's, tell us what your trying to accomplish and we'll build you a top end package from pushrods to carburetor that will maximize your combination to the fullest. We know what works!
IMO This is an Awesome head, we're making over 600HP with our 318/375 mule and it runs consistently within a couple of hundredths of a second on any given day. They're absolutely the best cylinder head you can bolt on to your small block Mopar if you want Maximum Power, Reliability, Consistency, Durability and you want to Win Races.
You cut the light these heads will make the power.
In 2008 we'll be running a 400" combination and fully expect to be deep into the mid 10's, same heads, same ET Slayer Cam, same ET Slayer Carb.....just a little Iron Headed SB Mopar, kickin' Big Block butts all over the race track.
The Formula.....
I'll give you the basics but we're not going to publish everything we do to make these heads work:
CnC ported intake and exhaust 2 available stages
1.94/1.60 valves in a specific length
Our Special CnC mounting track for the rocker arms to allow for taller valves and springs
Open the spring pockets to allow for a larger diameter spring
Surface the heads to RA 50 for FBO Spec Cometic MLS Gaskets"
I would seriously doubt he would post 600 hp on his site if he didnt have the **** to back it up.
Your ET / MPH computed from your vehicle weight of 3108 pounds and HP of 550 is 10.37 seconds and MPH of 130.26 MPH.
Your ET / MPH computed from your vehicle weight of 3108 pounds and HP of 600 is 10.08 seconds and MPH of 134.09 MPH.
3108 wt is posted on his website...says it runs 10.80.....about 4 tenths slow for it "stated horsepower"....maybe it is over stated...LOL
Your ET / MPH computed from your vehicle weight of 3108 pounds and HP of 600 is 10.08 seconds and MPH of 134.09 MPH.
3108 wt is posted on his website...says it runs 10.80.....about 4 tenths slow for it "stated horsepower"....maybe it is over stated...LOL
stroked340
Well-Known Member
magnummopar
Well-Known Member
Like I said, probably left the E brake on by accident.
magnummopar
Well-Known Member
Dont forget to correct for 1500-2500 ft elevation which is where many of our tracks are at. Look up Woodbern, Medford . coos bay is sea level but dont know what the times were there .
He also doesnt have very large rear tires but it still yanks the front end so must get considerable traction.
Hard to say until you are sitting next to him in burn out box and its go time. If you are in LV you must have raced him at some of the Mopar Muscle events.
stroked340
Well-Known Member
Checked his site out..
His eq's fully ported w 2.02 intake valves..$2400.00
Hughes cnc fully ported Eelbrocks opened up to a 2.08 intake valves..$2800.00 once again i'll take the aluminum
.. so much for the Edelbrocks being so much more
His eq's fully ported w 2.02 intake valves..$2400.00
Hughes cnc fully ported Eelbrocks opened up to a 2.08 intake valves..$2800.00 once again i'll take the aluminum
.. so much for the Edelbrocks being so much more
magnummopar
Well-Known Member
his come with $500 of Racer Brown full roller rockers....
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