2nd try? On the cheap friendly comp?

[Hersbird]

I'm not sure a young newbie would even be looking at v8, rwd, hard to find, probably rusted out, car that was made 15-30 years before they were even born. A kid could pick up a 1st gen Neon that needed a head gasket for $500 put a few more bucks in it and run the mid 14's get over 30 mpg and then put all these cars to shame on an autocross track. I think the only v8 RWD mopars most of them would consider would be the trucks. Also the first 5.7 Hemi Chargers are starting to get affordable (I've seen cop cars go $5000 in great shape) at least compared to a 60-70 A body.
I'm still looking but I always like to be outside the box so you may see me in a neon or a b3500 van stripped down with the motor moved behind the seats, like a modern Hemi under glass, but with "free candy" spray painted on the side LOL.

 

[540Valiant]

I'm not sure a young newbie would even be looking at v8, rwd, hard to find, probably rusted out, car that was made 15-30 years before they were even born. A kid could pick up a 1st gen Neon that needed a head gasket for $500 put a few more bucks in it and run the mid 14's get over 30 mpg and then put all these cars to shame on an autocross track. I think the only v8 RWD mopars most of them would consider would be the trucks. Also the first 5.7 Hemi Chargers are starting to get affordable (I've seen cop cars go $5000 in great shape) at least compared to a 60-70 A body.
I'm still looking but I always like to be outside the box so you may see me in a neon or a b3500 van stripped down with the motor moved behind the seats, like a modern Hemi under glass, but with "free candy" spray painted on the side LOL.

Then they probably wouldn't be on the FABO website!

 

[Hersbird]

Then they probably wouldn't be on the FABO website!

Then why supposedly tailor a competition for them? They ain't here, stop using them as an excuse as to why something is out of reach. I think 4 speeds are out of reach, at least I can't seem to afford one on $75k per year. Any car running a 4 speed in this competition needs $1200 added to the build cost if running a 4 speed because they are worth more then that. See what I mean?

 

[318willrun]

at least I can't seem to afford one on $75k per year. QUOTE]
75K a year..... YOU ARE RICH:blob:

 

[318willrun]

I'm not sure a young newbie would even be looking at v8, rwd, hard to find, probably rusted out, car that was made 15-30 years before they were even born. A kid could pick up a 1st gen Neon that needed a head gasket for $500 put a few more bucks in it and run the mid 14's get over 30 mpg and then put all these cars to shame on an autocross track. I think the only v8 RWD mopars most of them would consider would be the trucks. Also the first 5.7 Hemi Chargers are starting to get affordable (I've seen cop cars go $5000 in great shape) at least compared to a 60-70 A body.
I'm still looking but I always like to be outside the box so you may see me in a neon or a b3500 van stripped down with the motor moved behind the seats, like a modern Hemi under glass, but with "free candy" spray painted on the side LOL.

Go for the VAN!!!!!! AWESOME!!!! There was a 87 Diplomat on CL today for 650!!! There are opportunities...

 

[rumblefish360]

No.
If the car came with a 4spd, why add a $$$ figure to the car?
That is a penalty for how the car was born.

As far as a "Young Newbie" getting an old car. I agree! Why would they? I don't know but yet! Here they are! Besides, who said this is a Taylor's comp for young people. Are older people exempt from starting out as newbies to this?

If you can not afford a 4spd trans, I understand. It doesn't matter how much money you make it matters on how much money you keep at the end of the day. Out of that money, you save. The last thing you save for is the car. There's more important things than a hobby car to save for.
But do not use your own personal bench mark as a guide against someone else earning. Savings, bills and situation. This is unfair. To you and others. Let's say we have a 18YO at home and the parents give the go ahead to do a car. The kid works minim wage part time. 4 Hrs. a day for one year. That is 8K pre tax. 16K at 40 Hrs. That part time amount is double every last cent I could spare on a toy hobby car.

Should I penalize the kid?

Besides! Your not even competing. So why are you even posting?
You just like to seem to cause problems.
At least 451Cuda has thrown his hat into the ring.
I see your just Insitigating.
Another fly in the jelly jar!

 

[rumblefish360]

AVI, thanks man! Your awesome. The thread is getting long and I'm forgetting....

On a personal note, to anyone that thinks my pantyies may be getting in a not, not true at all. Perhaps the tone you read the list in needs adjusting. Because it isn't me. I'm good.
The only 2 FABO members that are causing any problems are;

451Cuda. He needs to read & understand the entire thread.

Hersbird; is not even competing but likes to throw in 2 cents to stir the pot. He has had posts deleted before and he is back starting in on this thread again.

My apologies for there short comings as adults but I didn't raise these trogs.
This make it frustrating.
We so far have 47 members wanting to do this, 1 that can not get one rule and constantly complains about it, 1 FABO member not competing but stirs the pot.

 

[rumblefish360]

at least I can't seem to afford one on $75k per year. QUOTE]
75K a year..... YOU ARE RICH:blob:

Now that truly depends on how much of that he can spend on a singular toy car.
If I told you I made $200,000 last year, you'd think I'd have a Lamborghini in the stable.
LOL! As life is now, I'm hobbling along in a 13 year old truck and my wife's Durango is a '99 we keep fixing. The O.D. / Speedometer just stopped working at 245K, drinks a quart a week, but it solider's on and she doesn't want to get rid of it! LMAO!
What ever the wife wants............

What you Earn and what you keep are two different things.

 

[318willrun]

Now that truly depends on how much of that he can spend on a singular toy car.
If I told you I made $200,000 last year, you'd think I'd have a Lamborghini in the stable.
LOL! As life is now, I'm hobbling along in a 13 year old truck and my wife's Durango is a '99 we keep fixing. The O.D. / Speedometer just stopped working at 245K, drinks a quart a week, but it solider's on and she doesn't want to get rid of it! LMAO!
What ever the wife wants............

What you Earn and what you keep are two different things.

Just having fun, and keeping it light! I know 75k doesn't make you rich these days.... I find life a blast, and that is how I try to live it!!!

 

[rumblefish360]

Amen brother!

 

[Hersbird]

AVI, thanks man! Your awesome. The thread is getting long and I'm forgetting....

On a personal note, to anyone that thinks my pantyies may be getting in a not, not true at all. Perhaps the tone you read the list in needs adjusting. Because it isn't me. I'm good.
The only 2 FABO members that are causing any problems are;

451Cuda. He needs to read & understand the entire thread.

Hersbird; is not even competing but likes to throw in 2 cents to stir the pot. He has had posts deleted before and he is back starting in on this thread again.

My apologies for there short comings as adults but I didn't raise these trogs.
This make it frustrating.
We so far have 47 members wanting to do this, 1 that can not get one rule and constantly complains about it, 1 FABO member not competing but stirs the pot.

Oh stop! I'm not causing any problems. I could just as easily say you are the biggest problem here if you read your responses. You go from acting all cool about everything to 100% off the walls with the slightest thing you disagree with.
I have had posts deleted? Awesome, I spent 11 years in the Navy defending the country so I can have an opinion deleted on some webboard about 30 year old Mopars. I guarantee whatever post that was was well within any guidelines of polite society. I don't know what your problem is with me, I'm a father of 2 girls, married 26 years to the same woman, and a decon at my church. I razz my pastor more then anyone on this board for Pete's sake.

 

[derrangedgadgeteer]

I'm not sure a young newbie would even be looking at v8, rwd, hard to find, probably rusted out, car that was made 15-30 years before they were even born. A kid could pick up a 1st gen Neon that needed a head gasket for $500 put a few more bucks in it and run the mid 14's get over 30 mpg and then put all these cars to shame on an autocross track. I think the only v8 RWD mopars most of them would consider would be the trucks. Also the first 5.7 Hemi Chargers are starting to get affordable (I've seen cop cars go $5000 in great shape) at least compared to a 60-70 A body.

At 16 (2006 AD), my first car was a '72 4-door dart with the slant six. Noone in my family has ever kept or worked on classics or hot rods, nor did I have any help picking out, buying, or fixing it. I drove it for three years before I tried to turbocharge it, but ran out of steam troubleshooting it. I also had a solid half dozen kids at my high school who drove olde classics every day.

'course, I live in the south, dunno if it's different for y'all yankees.

 

[451Cuda]

Oh stop! I'm not causing any problems. I could just as easily say you are the biggest problem here if you read your responses. You go from acting all cool about everything to 100% off the walls with the slightest thing you disagree with.
I have had posts deleted? Awesome, I spent 11 years in the Navy defending the country so I can have an opinion deleted on some webboard about 30 year old Mopars. I guarantee whatever post that was was well within any guidelines of polite society. I don't know what your problem is with me, I'm a father of 2 girls, married 26 years to the same woman, and a decon at my church. I razz my pastor more then anyone on this board for Pete's sake.

Amen. Feel like I'm trying to reason with a 15 year old.

I found it funny that my objection to the manual valve body rule was never given a satisfactory response, only avoidance and insults when he found he had no answer for me. Rumble did you ever find out if the Lokar kickdown works with CPPA 2" headers? Did you contact your neighbor with the '69 440 A-body? Still waiting on that one.

After some digging I found that that others had a problem with the manual valve body rule in the first attempt of this contest, and there was no satisfactory response then. So I came across this, and then it made sense:

Rani, you and I are from similar boats. I have allways had a 4spd manual car to have my fun in. This will be my first automatic car to actually run in any type of contest. Street or track.
Hence my question, "How DO you instal a manual valve body?"

LOL, I have not a clue! To busy working and raising children to have car fun.

So...it seems he will disallow a mod simply because he has no clue about it. I suspect the same situation exists with home porting....never done it, has no clue, therefore it's NOT ALLOWED! Is he qualified to lead something like this? As someone that actually did the budget build thing (and ran 11s on pump gas for less than $3k total - 25 years ago), I have to wonder.

Probably doesn't matter anyway, I doubt this gets anywhere and it'll probably be forgotten in a matter of months. But I'll wait and see, if it survives I'll play.

 

[rumblefish360]

Yawn... Good morning everyone.

I see nothing new is going on. Just the whiners complaining and making baseless and stupid comments. Waaaaaaa they go on & on! (Yawn!) but one point was actually made that is worth paying attention to!
Congrats to 451Cuda for actually making a point that will actually contribute to this!
Atta BOY!

Sunday bump for any ideas that may be brewing about.

after reading the above complainers complaints, the manual valve body issue (if you call it that) was never really brought up again. I gave my opinion and restated it. While my feeling about it is a not a warm fuzzy one, I do t remember exactly where everyone else is on it.

I am amused how the trouble makers find the above quote but fail to include anything else after the fact.
The quote above and there allegations there after that are a shameful act of trying to decieve you with half truths and lack of information.

Let's reveiw the basic idea of the thread.

A Freindly competition drag race that show cases how fast you can do it on the cheap. The idea is to show new guys how it could be done but yet still have a car as a daily driver.

Things like a manual valve body I thought were a bit much for a daily driver though I am aware of the "Pro" of such a device can be on the track. But is it something you could live with on the street? If I understand this device, correctly, once installed, you MUST manually shift the trans.

Not having done this before I asked how easy it is to do and I or should I say we all here were gifted with instructions laid out in order to how it's done. It certainl seems easy enough to me! LOL, one day, I might even try it.

1; Am I right or wrong on its operation?
2; how many of you would want a permanent manual automatic transmission in there car?

3; If I'm right about its operation, I myself wouldn't want it in my daily driver. Do you think someone new to this would accept this?

I'd like to hear from everybody.

 

[fishmens67]

the rules are set. let the fun begin and I mean it could get real fun.
I hope the spoilers lurking will play fair, and you know who you are.
Rumble, you have a good thing going here, keep'em in check.
have fun guys !

 

[318willrun]

451Cuda, just put your manual valve body in and live life happy. It's time for this to move on, the bickering will not advance newbies, or interest, or impress staff members. I seriously doubt with the cost of the cuda, 440 and tranny, manual valve body, exhaust, rear end, that no matter your E.T., your cost will be too high to be competitive. The vehicle I'm thinking on entering cost me 800.00 bucks. I hope not to put no more than 200 in upgrades. Total cost, I'm hoping, is to be right at 1k. Will it run with a big block cuda????? For your sake, I hope not!!!! LOL ! However, in a race of cheap, simple, street driver, and did I say CHEAP? I bet I take your big block cuda right out of this competition..... Let's line 'em up...... at the cash register!!!!!

 

[rumblefish360]

Thanks guys. These two guys just want to prattle on & on.
I suspect that 451 Cuda wants to join us with what he has. He is all set and ready to go a d run the track right now! Except, he has two things that do not fit into the basic outline.
Manual valve body
Home ported heads

Hersbird never joined the list and makes grand use of the key boards fonts without actually helping advance anything.

Fish/318, what do you guys think of the manual valve body issue?

 

[318willrun]

I would say manual valve bodies are accepted, but strongly discouraged. This will be a "knock" against that entry, but will not disqualify them. Here are my reasons why it would be a knock. 1). Unfriendly on the street, and most would have to explain to a Newbie on how to even drive the car, because most are reversed pattern and have to be manually shifted up, and back down. 2). Most newbies are not excited, or intimidated by "inside" automatic transmission work. 3). In this race, it is a 200 dollar or more cost that doesn't enhance the purpose of this race. Remember, this is a race on Cheap, Simplicity, and street friendly. Closer to stock the better, including exhaust manifolds over headers.... Lol

 

[451Cuda]

451Cuda, just put your manual valve body in and live life happy. It's time for this to move on, the bickering will not advance newbies, or interest, or impress staff members. I seriously doubt with the cost of the cuda, 440 and tranny, manual valve body, exhaust, rear end, that no matter your E.T., your cost will be too high to be competitive. The vehicle I'm thinking on entering cost me 800.00 bucks. I hope not to put no more than 200 in upgrades. Total cost, I'm hoping, is to be right at 1k. Will it run with a big block cuda????? For your sake, I hope not!!!! LOL ! However, in a race of cheap, simple, street driver, and did I say CHEAP? I bet I take your big block cuda right out of this competition..... Let's line 'em up...... at the cash register!!!!!

So are we comparing $ to ET? Or just overall cost? Seems like it's just completely subjective with no clear formula to gauge the success of an entry.

I know of a parts car I could buy for $400, and sell $1000 worth of parts from it. Is that allowed to start with a car that cost -$600? I used to be the king of free parts....I could do it here if it's allowed lol.

 

[fishmens67]

my brother and I did the cheap builds 30 years ago. having lived it and doing it on minimum wage money, I say no manual valve body, the only guys who had them were daddies boys or older guys. so, their cars weren't cheap builds. jmo

 

[rumblefish360]

So are we comparing $ to ET? Or just overall cost? Seems like it's just completely subjective with no clear formula to gauge the success of an entry.

Yes and no, stop the worry and have fun.
I doubt there will ever be a clear winner.
If I continue with the BB Duster, it's a loose loose except if you want or need a big block Duster in your life.

My '79 Magnum would be a better entry. It's entrance depends on my son in law. If he wants to take over the Duster and join in on this. He is all ready a mechanic, so coming home and screwing with a car is just... More work.

My Magnum (FWIW) is a $500 car
Not a bad start. Add a given (free) drivetrain and add headers intake (new) and a few used parts, carb, air cleaner, used exhaust pipes and mufflers.

I know of a parts car I could buy for $400, and sell $1000 worth of parts from it. Is that allowed to start with a car that cost -$600?

YES! And explain it like that! This would be excellent to show! And the money gained from said entry is of course rolled over into speed parts or what ever the car needs.
BRAVO MOVE!

I agree with 318's out look on the manual valve body use. If you feel you HAVE TO USE IT, well, use it but I just don't see it in a new guys car living in the street for a long time. Something's do not leave a lasting smile on your face.

 

[fishmens67]

Rumble, I'm sure you remember those days and those guys, we may have many here. lol

 

[318willrun]

So are we comparing $ to ET? Or just overall cost? Seems like it's just completely subjective with no clear formula to gauge the success of an entry.

I know of a parts car I could buy for $400, and sell $1000 worth of parts from it. Is that allowed to start with a car that cost -$600? I used to be the king of free parts....I could do it here if it's allowed lol.

$ rules, E.T. is nice. If you know of a car for 400, and you can sell 1000k off of it, do you really need this race to make this decision....????? LOL ! I'm now thinking you are trying to find a loop holes in the rules. If this is truly the case, go play someplace else. Again, it has already been discussed, that if your Dad "gives" you a 500 dollar induction system because your "his son", then you can't say there is no cost. Also, this is for fun, you don't win anything, and you are not going to even be the "king of FABO"! lol..

 

[451Cuda]

$ rules, E.T. is nice. If you know of a car for 400, and you can sell 1000k off of it, do you really need this race to make this decision....????? LOL ! I'm now thinking you are trying to find a loop holes in the rules. If this is truly the case, go play someplace else. Again, it has already been discussed, that if your Dad "gives" you a 500 dollar induction system because your "his son", then you can't say there is no cost. Also, this is for fun, you don't win anything, and you are not going to even be the "king of FABO"! lol..

The point is...scrounging, flipping, and making deals was and still is the core of budget car building. That's how I did it back then, because I worked part time at a grocery store! No one gave me anything...I got my hands greasy every damn day tearing parts cars apart, pissing off the neighbors with air tools running and lights blaring till midnight or later.

Anyway...the reason for doing it now would teach newbies how to stretch their dollars and go fast as cheap as possible. The whole point, right?

 

[crackedback]

It's easier to swap a valve body than to install a shift kit... just my personal observation. T/A Valve bodies can be had for $100-125 on the used front. Pretty darn cheap and that's almost on par with a TF2 or 3 kit plus install time if you ask me..

Don't you have to remove the valve body to install a shift kit? Hmmmmm

Am I limited on spending money on "THE" most important driveline part of this exercise?

My suggestion, STOP DENEGRATING PEOPLE because they ask a question or suggest an alternative. Whip that horse and it won't walk anymore!

Have fun with this I'm out.