4 speed ka-booom !

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j par

j par

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Well on the good side I won my very first - first round elimination! :burnout:
going for round two -do burnout, rev up and it jumped a little bit and then a terrible grinding. I thought it slipped out of gear so i jam it forward and it grinds again. So I tried second and grind. so i tried reverse - it worked but sounded grumbly.
So I empty oil and it's clean with lots of metal particles. Pulled gear box and opened up the side cover expecting to see mayhem and all I see is one small chipped tooth on what I believe to be first gear?
Is there something else that I'm not seeing ? ?
Thank you....
 
shift forks intact/bent ? you are going to have to disassemble it to find out more
 
Depending on how severe a "jump" it took you may want to look at your ring gear too.....
 
mguner said:
Depending on how severe a "jump" it took you may want to look at your ring gear too.....
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I was wondering about the rearend also . It sounds ok I guess, I mean I can hear the ring and pinion, being it's kind of quite in the garage. (I know this is no guarantee-but) i just put a new ring and pinion about 30 passes ago ?
 
j par said:
Is there something else that I'm not seeing ? ?
Thank you....
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Coulda stripped all the teeth inside the slider or on the main shaft; those are inside the 1-2 slider area so you'll have to pull it all apart to find all the damage.
 
nm9stheham said:
Coulda stripped all the teeth inside the slider or on the main shaft; those are inside the 1-2 slider area so you'll have to pull it all apart to find all the damage.
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as I do more research on what makes this thing tick (4 speed) what you're saying confirms my latest suspicions with the clues that I have so far. It looks as if I'm going to be out of drag racing for the season which is no real big deal. I mean I would have liked to have made the last race since I've made five of the six races this year but, it was just a learning curve year and also find all my weak spots which hopefully this is the last one for now. I'll probably have to look into a new transmission and then I will have this one to take apart and fiddle with and have a spare in case this happens again which in all likelihood the way I treat the car it will. Thank you for Your suspicions on my problem with the transmission.....
 
nm9stheham said:
That thing ought to be all apart this weekend! LOL Pretty straightforward to do.
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Finishing bathroom remodel for #1 fan- #1 pit crew member- a.k.a. my wife! this weekend.
going on honeymoon next week-- sooooo, I'll get a spot cleaned off to start the rebuild week after next.
just to give credit where credit is do - she's the one who insisted I have a "four on the floor"in the duster and drove near 300 miles to get it for me when i was busy at work. One can of worms at a time- LOL
 
Any recommendations on a a833 rebuilding book ? Maybe even with some dragstrip upgrades :D
 
The only upgrades for drag racing would be a liberty gears faceplate and heat treatment job.
Not a do it at home kind of mod.
The factory service manual in as good as any as a reference
of the rebuild process.
Not sure what year transmission you have but the ball and
detent side cover has a better design than the later interlock levers for racing. Trimmed steel forks work well with the early
side cover.
Never run ATF for gear lube unless you like to rebuild often.
 
Boring? perhaps. But lots more consistent, and easier on parts. But nothing sparks adrenaline like banging gears!

jpar
if you are at under 450 HP, like me, the hard parts in that 2.66 low box are almost indestructible. You may round of the clutch teeth or break brass forks or rings, and/or pop the struts out, but the gears and synchronizer assemblies can last for 40 or more years. I can't speak to more than 450hp, cuz I have not been there. I have built 833s for 500 hp, and so far none have come back.
But 30 passes on a small 8.75, and a noisy one at that; I would be looking into her. Especially since you say it worked in reverse, which drives the pinion backwards. I suspect the pinion nut worked loose and it climbed into the ring-gear.
Oh yeah, a chipped tooth on low gear, I wouldn't worry about, as long as the piece is not still in the tranny. And 50/50 ATF/EP oil works well.
G'luck
 
pettybludart said:
If your gonna race go auto...period.JMO
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And be like everyone else that likes to win automatically? That last round that I won and put that automatic Ford Mustang on the trailer was such a sweet victory- I took him at the light and at the finish line! I practically gave away a 727 that came with the car. Yes needless to say I'm pretty dedicated to the for speed. I've even purchased a hurst v-gate for next year's racing. I'm trying to keep the car old school as possible for when I pass it on to my son.
I love the photos of my son when we flew he in for the mopar nationals- he put 3 cars on their trailers that dayView attachment FB_IMG_14403405451231.jpg
 
ssba said:
The only upgrades for drag racing would be a liberty gears faceplate and heat treatment job.
Not a do it at home kind of mod.
The factory service manual in as good as any as a reference
of the rebuild process.
Not sure what year transmission you have but the ball and
detent side cover has a better design than the later interlock levers for racing. Trimmed steel forks work well with the early
side cover.
Never run ATF for gear lube unless you like to rebuild often.
Click to expand...

I think its a 1969 made fo 1970 and I do run the same Valvoline - i think 80/90 as in the rearend.
 
It's your money and time...I was just giving my opinion(JMO) from somebody that used to race with a 4 speed.I,ve won a lot more races with the auto and spent more time with racer friends at the track,instead of wrenching with broken parts.Congrats on your 1st round win.:cheers:
 
you probally wont like my advise either, but if your gonna stick with the four speed, just go ahead and buy a jerico or something similar. The factory boxes are good, but you will spend as much on a old factory box eventually.
 
Good advice on the auto but the 4 speed appeal is understood.... With the hard coupling of the drivetrain on a 4 speed in a racing discipline that emphasizes maximum traction, the impact loads are always going to be rough. Some gear oils like RedLine advertise better shock proofing, but I can't say if that works or not. (I've used it in rallying but that is more for endurance, not shock proofing.)

Now on dirt or gravel, it would be a whole different story: auto's are undesirable (IMO) and 4 speeds are the thing...
 
And if not money, a ton of time. Time; cutting,grinding, experimenting,swapping, etc.
But of course, for me, it was all worth it in the end. There's just no substitute for banging gears.
One of the best things, possibly THE best thing, I did to mine, was to move the shifter back and up.Back between the buckets, to a position that lets my arm hang nearly vertical, with my hand on the ball in neutral. And up as high as possible. And then a really short stick. And 1/2 inch nearly straight custom fabbed shift rods.
 
Don,t get me wrong J Par, I loved racing 4 speed.I just built another car(my 66 Dart) to beat on instead.My 73 Dart Sport with a mild stroke 372ci still has the 4 speed,Lakewood bell housing,Centerforce dual friction clutch.In the rear it has Moser axels,CE slide-A-link,and adj.shocks.To continue racing 4 speed I would need to go Jericho or Lenko $$$.Heck I bought and built my 66 Dart for the cost of either of those.Its just real expensive to be consistant and not always replacing broken parts.
 
:cheers:Thanks men for the feedback. I'm the only 4 speed in my class at the track. All my best cars in my life have all been automatic and i wished them all to be four speeds. When we got this car with an automatic it was the first thing to go before it was even on the road. I bought that (at the time).43 year old tranny sight unseen and over the last year and a half only abused it.
I'm sure I'm going to attempt rebuilding it myself as it seems it'll be a good thing to know seeing how I treat it.
I'll race it two more seasons and give it to my son in Colorado.
Now, I found a 360 with a 904 for $50 on Craigslist a couple of weeks ago and we plan a rebuild on that and I'm thinking about this thing I heard about modified 904 transmission ? All of this for the wife's 66 barracuda so she can drag race and I can pit crew. I'll probably go dirt track in a few years and you can bet you're hat it'll be a MOPAR !!!
this is totally my hobby and I don't mind working on it, as a matter of fact I love it !
 
I build a lot of these transmission's and there damn strong, but depending how your launching, the weak point will eventually go, and it aint going to be the rear end normally! are you using a 2 step or just dumping it to the clutch? One old school trick I have done for years is tapering the ends of the slider shoes, and hardening them as mentioned above, this is probably the weakest part of the gear box, and it will normally be the part that blows apart first. And I applaud you for running a stick car even with the technology out the with the automatic's, nothing better then banging gear's like Ronnie Sox, and Dick Landy used too!!!!
 
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