David Vizard, Uncle Tony's garage, Unity motorsport. Mission impossible Dodge 302 Head porting

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kdeboy said:
Yep. I have a set of Scat I beams. Weight on the box is 582 g. A stock 318 rod weighs ~726 (early style) or ~758 g. That works out to about 5 or 6 ounces lighter (converted b/c oz. is easier for me to visualize than grams) for the Scat rods, plus I get cap screws instead of bolts, the sides are smooth out of the box, and they're ready to go. Paid $439 plus sales tax, picked them up same day.

I watched DV's video on the rod work, I don't think he took off anywhere close to 5 ounces, and if it took 30 minutes per rod and you had to pay someone to do the work, I'd be willing to bet that just the labor cost would be $400 just for the beam work. So cheaper AND better just to go with the Scat rods. However, if I was on a really tight budget and could do the work myself, I think modifying the stock rods would be a worthwhile improvement. Sure it would require the engine to be rebalanced, but so do the Scat rods.

I think the DV/AW build is interesting and I enjoy watching the videos. Even if I can't do everything they do, they show the thought process of what goes into improving an engine and making parts choices, instead of just calling different companies or posting questions on internet forums and going with whatever advice you're given. Heck, I even learn stuff from watching UT's videos sometimes (like what NOT to do :) ).
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Yep, nothing wrong with lightening the stock rods but it takes time. If you do it yourself and your time isn't worth anything then go for it. But, in addition to sanding the beams with a belt sander, they still should be sized with new bolts and balanced. At machine shop labor rates per hour you can buy a set of new rods for less.
 
PRH said:
There are plenty of “stock replacement” pistons out there that would accommodate an over bore.

But that’s not even remotely close to what they’re talking about using.

It’s click bait BS...... that’s it.
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What are they using? I assumed the tallest CH piston available to get the CR up.
 
toolmanmike said:
Yep, nothing wrong with lightening the stock rods but it takes time. If you do it yourself and your time isn't worth anything then go for it. But, in addition to sanding the beams with a belt sander, they still should be sized with new bolts and balanced. At machine shop labor rates per hour you can buy a set of new rods for less.
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I've been out of work for almost 2 years, so time isn't a problem. Also taking an engine rebuilding class with my son this spring so for a few months I'll have access to some tools that normally wouldn't be available to me. Now all I gotta do is find a core :)
 
kdeboy said:
Yep. I have a set of Scat I beams. Weight on the box is 582 g. A stock 318 rod weighs ~726 (early style) or ~758 g. That works out to about 5 or 6 ounces lighter (converted b/c oz. is easier for me to visualize than grams) for the Scat rods, plus I get cap screws instead of bolts, the sides are smooth out of the box, and they're ready to go. Paid $439 plus sales tax, picked them up same day.

I watched DV's video on the rod work, I don't think he took off anywhere close to 5 ounces, and if it took 30 minutes per rod and you had to pay someone to do the work, I'd be willing to bet that just the labor cost would be $400 just for the beam work. So cheaper AND better just to go with the Scat rods. However, if I was on a really tight budget and could do the work myself, I think modifying the stock rods would be a worthwhile improvement. Sure it would require the engine to be rebalanced, but so do the Scat rods.

I think the DV/AW build is interesting and I enjoy watching the videos. Even if I can't do everything they do, they show the thought process of what goes into improving an engine and making parts choices, instead of just calling different companies or posting questions on internet forums and going with whatever advice you're given. Heck, I even learn stuff from watching UT's videos sometimes (like what NOT to do :) ).
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What part number did you use for the rods on the 318?
 
318willrun said:
they have a few different models of that part number. These I assume ? Floating?
SCAT Engine Components 2-ICR6123-2124 Scat Pro Comp I-Beam Connecting Rods | Summit Racing

They also have these for the same money ?
Speedmaster PCE274.1047 Procomp Electronics H-Beam Connecting Rods | Summit Racing
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Yep the top one. I think the only difference between that one and the 2124A is ARP 8740 vs ARP 2000 bolts and $60. Plus Summit had the cheaper ones in stock and the ARP 2000 version was "special order".
 
This thing have a couple of turbos and FI on it yet?

Where'd the goalpost go AGAIN?

Only reason to click on anything from that youtube is by accident.
 
Rat Bastid said:
Are you asking me or Bakerlite? Or both?
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Both and anyone. Please and thank you! I am here to learn and pursue the hobby. Keyboard commando is what inkjunkie called it, but that's what I am. Retired from submarines so I have bought the magazines, the books (for deployment), and now I have time to really pursue the hobby.

(I bet that might be the majority of people/readers/lurkers that will later read these posts are similar, they are unfamiliar with the tech.)

I don't have your (perhaps most contributors here) experience which is far above magazine sales, snake oil, etc.

I bought and read David Vizard's books and he barely covers specific techniques and broadly expounds on processes. He covers concepts and scientific generalizations without the specific explanations of how to do performance gains. He makes some grandious claims with his SBC, BBC, and SBF builds-questionably high numbers.

I don't give a **** about how little I know (or mind illustrating my ignorance of this craft), I love this hobby and have greatly succeeded elsewhere in life so I don't have anything to prove. You guys have done the leg work, and if I could, I would happily learn everything you would share. I have one flaw that greatly pisses off rustyratrod, maybe others. Sometimes people share information and I question it (because I want to learn/not to challenge, but that's how it is often received) because it might contradict something I read (often from a magazine or less reputable source) elsewhere. Thanks to everyone here for their contributions. Thank you very much!
 
Cudafever said:
Did you see DV lighten up that stock rod. Wow that is a lot of hard work!!!!!
Let me enlighten you who don't under stand. yes that is FREE FREE FrEe!!!! but if you can't make all of them the same weight on the small end of the rod and the big end of the rod, it wont be balanced. So there is Why,
Way more time beyond what he showed, the requires more then a die grinder and your time.

And now here is were the "hidden" HUGE" $$$$$$ sign" come in to play. Because you don't just have the crank balance with a couple of holes driller in the counter weight.
You wait and see what that crank looks like when there done!!!!! And all that grinding and remove of metal YOU CAN't do. YOU will pay an exorbitant amount of money to the machine shop and the balance guy.

Now that i have went off on this rant:mob: I realize that my 408 stoker rod will come in lighter then the rods DV is doing and the piston will be close to the same weight as i my using........and the balance price was not that bad..............So I guess i'm talking out may ArSS again:realcrazy::lol:
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toolmanmike: "Yep, nothing wrong with lightening the stock rods but it takes time. If you do it yourself and your time isn't worth anything then go for it. But, in addition to sanding the beams with a belt sander, they still should be sized with new bolts and balanced. At machine shop labor rates per hour you can buy a set of new rods for less."

Yeah that's another question I have. How does working one side of the rod regarding balance effect the other side? If he grinds off an ounce on one side, does that throw off any necessary balance from the other side of the rod? and how? If they are recipicating versus rotating, how does rod balance work?
 
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greymouser7 said:
Both and anyone. Please and thank you! I am here to learn and pursue the hobby. Keyboard commando is what inkjunkie called it, but that's what I am. Retired from submarines so I have bought the magazines, the books (for deployment), and now I have time to really pursue the hobby.

(I bet that might be the majority of people/readers/lurkers that will later read these posts are similar, they are unfamiliar with the tech.)

I don't have your (perhaps most contributors here) experience which is far above magazine sales, snake oil, etc.

I bought and read David Vizard's books and he barely covers specific techniques and broadly expounds on processes. He covers concepts and scientific generalizations without the specific explanations of how to do performance gains. He makes some grandious claims with his SBC, BBC, and SBF builds-questionably high numbers.

I don't give a **** about how little I know (or mind illustrating my ignorance of this craft), I love this hobby and have greatly succeeded elsewhere in life so I don't have anything to prove. You guys have done the leg work, and if I could, I would happily learn everything you would share. I have one flaw that greatly pisses off rustyratrod, maybe others. Sometimes people share information and I question it (because I want to learn/not to challenge, but that's how it is often received) because it might contradict something I read (often from a magazine or less reputable source) elsewhere. Thanks to everyone here for their contributions. Thank you very much!
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Great post! Never settle for mediocrity.
 
I am far from the guy to answer a balancing question but i will give you what i think i know
they us a tool that pivots on the small end of the rod and weights the other end.........and i thing they do the same for the other end.
then that is figured out some way with a mathematical equation and then they bolt that weight on the rod journal and then spin it in a crank balance machine balance to see were it is out of balance.
Basic concept is like a driveling balancing machine.
let me see if i can find something for you.

There is a ton of grate info on U-tube!!!!!!

Here is a real good one on balancing cranks!
 
Sounds like some of the stuff we did in the 1970’s. Grind the heck out of stock rods with a carbide burr and sand them up with sanding rolls. Then off they went to the machine shop for new rod bolts, resizing, and balance job. Man I’m glad I Dont have that stuff to do anymore. Making junk out of junk.
 
pittsburghracer said:
Sounds like some of the stuff we did in the 1970’s. Grind the heck out of stock rods with a carbide burr and sand them up with sanding rolls. Then off they went to the machine shop for new rod bolts, resizing, and balance job. Man I’m glad I Dont have that stuff to do anymore. Making junk out of junk.
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Putting lipstick on a pig.
Turd buffing.
Stepping over donuts to pick up dog turds.

Lots of ways to call it what it is.
 
Stock rods balanced. New bolts and resized. I didn't need any more than that.

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Back from balance 006.jpg
 
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Shew, after reading all this, I wonder why I ever quit rolling “left handed dandies!” The whole stock 318 BBD two barrel deal makes the whole thing a joke. Allowing a modified stock intake with an out of the box Holley performance two barrel would possibly make the whole premise marginally more viable. This being a dyno engine and having access to a bandsaw and all, why not just go to hacking on the heads and intake and going back with fiberglass and aluminum and build an experimental tunnel port head. I’d probably watch it if I could see some useful R&D experimentation come out of it that could be used for the design of the next latest and greatest small block head, not just a glorified s**t show with a die grinder…
 
crackedback said:
This thing have a couple of turbos and FI on it yet?

Where'd the goalpost go AGAIN?

Only reason to click on anything from that youtube is by accident.
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I'm not trying to be a ARSS hat at all but here is just a couple examples of grate stuff on U-Tube


I have NO desire to run build or own a drag bike, But his podcast are good and i don't miss a one of them. after he finishes is podcasts, his wife down load them to U-Tube. and that were i watch them.
https://www.youtube.com/@GeorgeBryceStar

Then you have jakck arss like this that polute the u-tube air waves.:poke::lol:
 
greymouser7 said:
He said he made a bunch of mistakes earlier. PLEASE explain to me how did he recover..?
I was under the impression that these heads don't have alot?/as-much? metal to remove as the typical 340/360 iron head.
Did he remove even more metal to fix his ?loss of swirl? and/or metal-removing which was ?in the wrong place?,
I get the impression from reading MoparOfficial's posts that this guy doesn't know what he is doing porting these particular heads compared to the Mopar porters that we "generally" know of. An impression, not a manifesto or attack.
I always wondered how Ryan at shadydell put 2.02's in those heads.
Couldn't our Mopar porters do better? like why isn't he putting in mopar 1.88" (or even magnum 1.92" and new valve guides) intake valves and 1.60" exhaust valves?
All the hours of porting, the stones used in valve jobs, that has to be more expensive than buying some common valves.
These guys' (head porters, DV, machine shop guys, etc.) time invested has to be worth more than even the youtube viewer payout.
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I‘ll take a shot at this. Bakerlite is a big boy so I don’t speak for him. If he has something to add he is perfectly capable of do it.

I never said Servedio was making mistakes. Since I’ve been porting heads since 1988 I knew exactly what he was getting into. A ton of work for sure.

IMO, he could have made more air (and more power) with way less work. That was my big criticism of the whole project. That and they are changing up quite a bit of stuff from what UT originally laid out.

If you get the chance, watch all of the videos Servedio put on YouTube. Don’t forget to at least LIKE his videos when you watch or better yet, subscribe and LIKE. It helps get his content out there.

Anyway, watch his videos and see how he went about figuring out where the air was, where it wasn’t and how he got it to do what he wanted. He did damn good work and anyone can learn some things from him.

What impressed me the most (as I’m a HUGE advocate of steeper than 45 degree valve seats for most everything) was that Servedio spent the time to grind a 50 degree valve job on there and test it. And it‘s harder for him because he is doing it with a stone.

Its much easier, quicker and simpler to use a seat and guide machine or a mill to used a forming tool to cut the seats, doing all the cuts at the same time.

It looks like he’s never done a 50 before, or maybe not many and his results mirror mine. And he kept with it, chipping away here and there until he got some impressive numbers out of that casting.

My problem was never with doing the project. It was with what I knew what was coming and that was mission creep. And the sheer amount of time that was put into those heads.

I‘ve BTDT so I knew what was coming. I know I wouldn’t want to pay for the bill to port those heads.

His results speak for themselves and Servedio did a damn nice job. If it doesn’t make the power they want it won’t be because of his heads if they use them.
 
pittsburghracer said:
Sounds like some of the stuff we did in the 1970’s. Grind the heck out of stock rods with a carbide burr and sand them up with sanding rolls. Then off they went to the machine shop for new rod bolts, resizing, and balance job. Man I’m glad I Dont have that stuff to do anymore. Making junk out of junk.
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People sometimes get nostalgic for the oldways where 500 hp smallblock took talent and a skill not catalog and a credit card.
 
273 said:
People sometimes get nostalgic for the oldways where 500 hp smallblock took talent and a skill not catalog and a credit card.
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Been there done that and guys are still talking about my street car from the 1970- early 1980’s. I didn’t have to leave town to race. They came looking for me. Just st so I didn’t get any stupid ideas I sold off my last five stock small block heads for 40.00. Two of the guys I raced back in those days now have Pro Mods and they still shake their heads at what I did with a low buck duster.
 
Not to mention, the entire project was supposed to be "uncle tony's" brainchild, but yet, here we are with a host of other people doing the work, having (by necessity) to move the goalposts repeatedly. The clown who has a video on checking to see if your bores are straight and round by using a freaking carpenter's square, and how to port your heads in your shower.
 
replicaracer43 said:
Not to mention, the entire project was supposed to be "uncle tony's" brainchild, but yet, here we are with a host of other people doing the work, having (by necessity) to move the goalposts repeatedly. The clown who has a video on checking to see if your bores are straight and round by using a freaking carpenter's square, and how to port your heads in your shower.
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I feel this whole thing was for DV and his camp to get some of tony's viewership, it's helping Charles's channel with views from this site.
 
273 said:
I feel this whole thing was for DV and his camp to get some of tony's viewership, it's helping Charles's channel with views from this site.
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I agree, I believe the whole thing is a "clickbait" and....... the other side of that is, why dont they do some QUALITY work for the public and make a living that way, as apposed to all this youtube panhandling
 
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