Easiest 727/904 rebuild thread...

[12many]

Well it took about an hour to get the transmission apart and in subsections. But I'll ask this one is a bust it's pretty much all paperweight...
I'll have to start again with a better transmission. I did expect to have to replace most of the guts with another transmission that I have it was not expecting the actual big block outer housing could be damaged as well. Also I was hoping the tail shaft was going to be usable but it looks like that is rusted beyond usability...
Looks like I'll get another one and try again...
Also you can see where I stuck with screwdriver inside there once the valve body was off. I took out the front pump bolts in from behind tapped it with a screwdriver on the sides and on the top real lightly till it popped out. This avoids having all the pullers and all that and I even posted a picture of the back side of it after it came out you can see the little scratches at the scrubber put in it but no real damage I'm sure this won't be seen when you cross the mirrors up Eric jackson lol...

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I’m surprised you didn’t see my posts in some other thread(s) about making cheap slide hammers to pull the pump in a more proper fashion. Whatever works ultimately. This is the only way I roll when pulling the pump. As long as one has long *** bolts you could also use anything heavy that has a hole in it for the sliding weight. Anyway, here’s my setup, guaranteed to not give some here heart palpitations, send them into cardiac arrest....seizures, blow a gasket etc.

find 3/8-16 bolts (8” length shown) some washers, and use two of the biggest sockets you have (1-1/4” impact shown) and assemble as shown. Thread into the threaded pump holes (9 and 3) and violà! Instant slide hammers.
Long carriage bolts would work as well, might be cheaper that what I’ve shown.

 

[fishmens67]

My manual kit does not use the kick down feature, tire chirping shifts, hang on to your hat we're getting ready to shift

 

[j par]

I’m surprised you didn’t see my posts in some other thread(s) about making cheap slide hammers to pull the pump in a more proper fashion. Whatever works ultimately. This is the only way I roll when pulling the pump. As long as one has long *** bolts you could also use anything heavy that has a hole in it for the sliding weight. Anyway, here’s my setup, guaranteed to not give some here heart palpitations, send them into cardiac arrest....seizures, blow a gasket etc.
View attachment 1716045389
find 3/8-16 bolts (8” length shown) some washers, and use two of the biggest sockets you have (1-1/4” impact shown) and assemble as shown. Thread into the threaded pump holes (9 and 3) and violà! Instant slide hammers.
Long carriage bolts would work as well, might be cheaper that what I’ve shown.

Honestly this is the very first time I wasn't able to just give it a few light taps on a long screwdriver from the inside and have it just pop right out... Of course tightening the band closest to the front to hold the guts in first... So fast and simple....

 

[12many]

Honestly this is the very first time I wasn't able to just give it a few light taps on a long screwdriver from the inside and have it just pop right out... Of course tightening the band closest to the front to hold the guts in first... So fast and simple....

Yup, whatever works!

 

[CudaFactHackJob]

Are you referring to the band apply lever, or the throttle valve lever that would be the "wrong arm"?

I'm referring to the kickdown lever on the outside of the trans. It has to be all the way back when the carb is all the way open. If you stray from that adjustment, then the arm will never go all the way back; lowering the pressure to the shift, or the carb won't be allowed to open all the way; hurting performance. You don't "fiddle" with adjusting that to relieve pressure on the kd as jpar suggested because it will lower the shift pressure and burn the band and 3rd gear clutch. (of course he'll deny saying that) Incompatible linkage can cause a late or early shift. The ratio between the carb, kd arm, and sometimes bellcrank has to be such that the initial arc of the kd arm is timed properly. Summary; if the kd arm does not go all the way back at wide open throttle; friction material will burn.

 

[j par]

Okay today I will have some time to get some progress on the 904... Case and tail housing as clean as necessary on the outside I'll clean and blow out the inside extra good with carb cleaner and compressed air. Once I get that done I'll give it a small spray of lubricant to keep everything from getting dry inside...
I'll set the case aside at the ready while I clean the bench and start getting things organized for the subsections...

 

[j par]

So again trying to kill the time space and tool myth... I just had a horrendously dirty case and again recapping that I hit it with the power washer out on the front driveway which of the guy didn't have one could use the one at the local car wash... Then I soaked it in WD-40 and took a screwdriver and scraped off any heavy stuff I could and took it out back on the patio on a fold out card table that I got for free sitting out across the street from a customer's house and he grabbed one too and we both used them for just this purpose.. anyways I would go out for 10-15 minutes each day scrubbing with a wire wheel wire brush and redoucing it in WD-40.. the other day I gave it one last power wash and called it good... So far tools were just wire brushes wire wheels on my drill a screwdriver and a pick tool to scrape with and WD-40 and my power washer. Each day I only took like 10-15 minutes just kept poking away at it till I got it reasonably clean.
Hopefully most of you don't have a case this bad and can skip 90% of the step and just give a quick power wash or something and be done with it...

 

[j par]

Okay I went out to the back patio and just grab the case and tail housing and set them inside here I think I'm just going to leave those alone for now and do a final extra clean out and blow out just before I start assembling it. But again I've got the big grime under control now. I've got to get this bench cleaned up so I can start doing subsections. I'll be able to work on it for a little while today and maybe even for a few minutes tomorrow but for the next week after that I have a lot of stuff planned so I won't be able to get to it for about a week. And again this is time, people in their mind think that this needs to get done lickity split when it could sit at the professional transmission shop for weeks waiting to be done and or you just getting time to put it back in or take it out. As long as things are kept organized this shouldn't ever be a problem and also taking lots of pictures to reference...
Now let's see what I can get done after I get this bench cleaned up...

 

[j par]

Okay that just took about 10 minutes..

 

[j par]

Okay so first thing I pulled out was the first thing in line the pump. It looks horrid... Now had I just been giving this transmission a refresh and it was previously in working order in recent history and stored correctly I probably would skip a lot of this process and just flush it out real well with cleaners turning it pumping it and flushing it out real well with lubricants. Just to get the contaminants out of it.... The 727 in my power wagon was actually a good running transmission that just broke the reverse band so I just cleaned it all out and put new seals on it and stuff and let it run. And it's ran fine.
This one on the other hand as you can see in the pictures is pretty damn rough. It's going to need a complete overhaul... Which is good for this thread.. the first thing I did was take off the two ring seals on the inside snout and and pulled the spacer off as well and laid them out in order. I flipped it over to the input side and plucked the front seal out and mangled it a bit but this is no big deal cuz we'll put a new one in. Also laying on the table you'll see the big rubber seal that goes around the outside of the pump itself. And of course the gasket on the inside outer ring.
A tip I got from watching a factory rebuild video was to put a scribe across the pump gears to know where to mesh them together and know which side faces up..
I had to bite the bullet and go down and get a new brush wire brush. I said to myself here we go Ace hardware they're going to want four or five bucks for it and I was wrong they wanted seven! Damn it!!!...

 

[j par]

So I just called transmission exchange company here in Portland and talk to brian... He said a standard rebuild kit with standard clutches seals and gaskets was $108.. the front bushing was $6 and I believe the rear bushing which I might have one of those possibly was extra as well but I can't remember how much. The bearing on the rear tail shaft is a little ratchety but I'm going to see if I can work that out it was $59 and for this I'm not prepared to spend that much for a stupid bearing.
I thought I had a parts transmission but maybe not. I looked around in my shed but I did take a lot of scrap metal back recently this last summer to get rid of some of my heart so I may have shot myself in the foot I'm not sure...

 

[mopowers]

Stupid question, but why is it important to assemble the pump rotors the same way?

 

[j par]

Stupid question, but why is it important to assemble the pump rotors the same way?

I can't see a real advantage to it either but again it was something the guy in the Chrysler old school rebuild video did for like teaching factory technicians about rebuilding them or something.... Also he put feeler gauges in there for exacting acceptable tolerances and stuff like that...

 

[j par]

So I'm going to try and reiterate this several times. This transmission is just supposed to be a get it going on a budget kind of deal. Well I am going through everything and making sure everything is clean I'm only going to replace the absolute barebones minimum... And actually maybe even less than that LOL...
Now when I do the 727 for the big block I will be replacing at the very least every field gasket steel and clutch...
On this 904 even some of the stuff I'm doing now is more experimental than anything else to see what I can get away with...
If you're building one of these transmissions for your car to last a long time at the very bare minimum I would change all the clutches steels lip seals and gaskets.

 

[Bakerlite]

Last thing you want to see is water in the trans, especially the pump.

 

[j par]

So here's where I'm experimenting a little I got the pump cleaned up and I'm pointing at the machine service on the outside of the pump and the brass bushing on the inside of the pump. Both of which I took the lightest buff of 600 grit wet and dry sandpaper just to get a shine on them not sand them down but just get them smooth and clean...
(Hack job should be just about losing his brain about now LOL...)
Of course I don't recommend any of this rebuilding your transmission I would just change the bushings and get new parts...
Also I dug through some of my parts and found a nice tail house bushing I also got on the tail shaft and just cleaned up the bearing which that was $59 forget that...
Again if this was a keeper I'd buy the back bearing and I'd buy new pump gears for $20..

 

[j par]

Also today I was able to get into the drum behind the pump... First I set the band aside and used a flat screwdriver to pop out the large retaining ring.. (very simple..) then on top the thick pressure plate steel.. then clutch then steal then collection of steel and so on.. all three clutches looked in very good condition and the 3 steals look like they needed to be cleaned up..
Here's the part that I made that piece of sea metal for to put in the vise and push it on and get the snap ring out to retain the large spring that holds the bottom piston in. It just has a seal around the outside and went around the inside. Under a normal rebuild you're just going to the kit to the ones that match and replace them. When I get back to this I'm going to get that out and expect the seals.. again only things that absolutely have to be replaced will be replaced on this particular project but if you're rebuilding these would definitely be replaced...

 

[j par]

This...

 

[Duane]

I rebuilt a C4 for a guy one time. He called and said it didn't work; wouldn't even move. He said he revved it and nothing. Had a new torque converter he bought off a buddy... So he brings the trans back along with the converter. I said where's the converter? He picks it up out of his trunk with one hand; like an 8" donut...5k stall...His old worn out 302 two barrel couldn't even rev high enough to hit stall.


says the guy who made this statement

Lol I remember that lol.

 

[Duane]

Mopar Sam has given me permission to go ahead and post this video that he made. It's more so to get the pump off and varies from some of the techniques that I use but I like it.
The difference here being where he takes his front band off and pulls everything out with the pump I under their hand tight in the front band so just the pump comes out by itself at first. That's about the only difference I can think of besides his technique... Thank you mopar Sam for this DIY video...

Lol I love it simple shade tree special trick.
When I was an apprentice many years ago, a tradesman taught me that no matter how long you have been doing something that works, there is always another correct way and to always keep an open mind.

 

[Duane]

This is ridiculous. You're telling beginners to take apart things that even seasoned rebuilders don't disassemble. Remove the shaft from the reverse servo piston? OMG why? Soaking clutches OVERNIGHT? That 727 reverse servo spring retainer looks like you installed backwards. The spring will pop off center and **** the piston sideways; losing reverse. Go back to school.

If you zoom in on the picture, he does have the retainer the right way. It is just the way it looks in the pic that it upside down.
But if you zoom in, it is correct.
Cut the guy some slack.

 

[j par]

If you zoom in on the picture, he does have the retainer the right way. It is just the way it looks in the pic that it upside down.
But if you zoom in, it is correct.
Cut the guy some slack.

Last year I did the 727 in my power wagon which I got on a great deal because the transmission had lost reverse. He pulled the transmission out and got a supposedly good working long shaft transmission and he thought he could just change the shaft housing from behind. LOL he gave up on it and gave me both transmissions in the truck for an astronomically low price and all I had to do was replace the reverse band. When he showed me the piece that's missing in this picture I knew exactly what it was LOL...
This is the point of the thread just don't sell your vehicle because you broke a reverse band LOL of course I put new clutches and a shift kit and stuff in it cleaned it and rebuilt it a little bit new lip seals and gaskets. That's all I'm trying to teach here just for the hobby guys who can do it themselves or just need a little encouragement. I sincerely appreciate your input because I know it will be positive you just strike me that way again thank you...
Also this guy didn't see that I had to change that spring so I had to take it apart it was the only time that I had to take one of those apart because of this obvious picture besides that I would have just changed the seals...
Through personal messages and outright saying it here on this thread I've taken the advice of everyone and just put him on ignore for a while...

 

[Duane]

Last year I did the 727 in my power wagon which I got on a great deal because the transmission had lost reverse. He pulled the transmission out and got a supposedly good working long shaft transmission and he thought he could just change the shaft housing from behind. LOL he gave up on it and gave me both transmissions in the truck for an astronomically low price and all I had to do was replace the reverse band. When he showed me the piece that's missing in this picture I knew exactly what it was LOL...
This is the point of the thread just don't sell your vehicle because you broke a reverse band LOL of course I put new clutches and a shift kit and stuff in it cleaned it and rebuilt it a little bit new lip seals and gaskets. That's all I'm trying to teach here just for the hobby guys who can do it themselves or just need a little encouragement. I sincerely appreciate your input because I know it will be positive you just strike me that way again thank you...
Also this guy didn't see that I had to change that spring so I had to take it apart it was the only time that I had to take one of those apart because of this obvious picture besides that I would have just changed the seals...
Through personal messages and outright saying it here on this thread I've taken the advice of everyone and just put him on ignore for a while...
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Agreed. He did not know why you were taking the servo apart, but he didn’t give you the benefit of a doubt that you might know what you doing either.
Carry on, you’re doing just fine.
I have dealt with Cudaback Hack before.
The thing that gets me is that he and I together without criticizing each other walked a member on here through a complete rebuild for his first time and he was very helpful, so I will give him that.
But for some reason he has chosen to jump on you without having all the facts.
I simply wanted to point that out to him and defend you. That picture came out funny because when I first saw it, it did look upside down, but I chose to look a little closer and realized it was not upside down.
There are a few rebuilders on here that must feel the need to drum up work by bullshitting everyone that they cannot handle this job.
I am sure there are plenty of people out there that are not mechanically inclined and would have no choice but to bring their business to him. He just does not seem to understand that on a forum like this that is full of the diy type that rebuild engines etc, they are probably quite capable to rebuild a torqueflite given a little help.
You have lots of follower watching this, keep up the good work.

 

[sireland67]

So here's where I'm experimenting a little I got the pump cleaned up and I'm pointing at the machine service on the outside of the pump and the brass bushing on the inside of the pump. Both of which I took the lightest buff of 600 grit wet and dry sandpaper just to get a shine on them not sand them down but just get them smooth and clean...
(Hack job should be just about losing his brain about now LOL...)
Of course I don't recommend any of this rebuilding your transmission I would just change the bushings and get new parts...
Also I dug through some of my parts and found a nice tail house bushing I also got on the tail shaft and just cleaned up the bearing which that was $59 forget that...
Again if this was a keeper I'd buy the back bearing and I'd buy new pump gears for $20..

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Are you working in socks?

 

[12many]

Are you working in socks?

I see a footsie.