AJ/FormS
68 Formua-S fastback clone 367/A833/GVod/3.55s
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- Jan 19, 2014
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I saw that and it looks great
Faceplated 833 4 Speed
- Thread starter 1975abody
- Start date
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weedburner
Well-Known Member
On my Toploader I wanted to retain a synchro on 1st with a faceplated 2nd, so I had to do the modifications myself (welded slider) as Liberty only offered Pro-Shifted 2nd with a synchro'd 1st.
Grant
yellow rose
Overnight Sensation
How long ago was that?? I called earlier this year and I thought Liberty would do a face plate on second with a synchro first???
19DART66
Well-Known Member
When I had my 3.09 first gear 833 done by Liberty they could only face plate 3rd and 4th gear. So I had them synchro first and pro shift second. 45 to 50 year old parts only last for so long though, so eventually I ended up with a Jerico Dr-4, I figured newer would have to be stronger, better and 50 pounds lighter. When did Liberty start face plating second gear?
weedburner
Well-Known Member
I originally faceplated the Toploader back around 2010 or so. Freshened it up a few years ago, flipped the 3/4 slider around and put a new 2nd gear faceplate on the 1/2 slider.
Grant
yellow rose
Overnight Sensation
Ok. I should face plate my junk. I'm still doing the old slick shift crap. Haven't killed it yet. But it really should be face plated. Or at least pro shifted.
Used to be you couldn't but he pro shift rings from Liberty. If they now sell them I could use the tool post grinder and take the teeth off the gear, press on the ring and TIG weld it on, probably using a stainless Rod. Hmmmmmmmm
weedburner
Well-Known Member
I removed the synchro dog teeth from the gears with a carbide insert, welded the rings with soft .035 wire in the MIG. Big trick is skipping around and not letting heat get out of hand. On the ring welded to the side of the 1/2 slider, I used short 3/8" long welds followed by air blast cooling. The weld zone was pretty close to the heat treated dogs and reverse gear teeth, air cooling between short welds kept the dogs themselves cool enough that I could touch them to my cheek.
My thought for using soft weld wire was it would help "absorb" some of the stresses between the two heat treated parts. Not a single problem with the process has surfaced, in the Saginaw application I have even cut dog rings from broken gears and then welded that ring to a different gear. No problems there either.
Grant
yellow rose
Overnight Sensation
So the carbide insert didn't care about the interrupted cut? At least until all the teeth were gone? Usually carbide hates an interrupted cut.
What wire did you use? I don't have a wire feed here so I'll just TIG it.
Maybe I should just face plate it if Liberty will sell the plates.
weedburner
Well-Known Member
Carbide might have cared a little, but did the job
I used ER70S-6 filler, quite a bit softer than the parent metals. I think the faceplate parts are case hardened 9310.Grant
I've been talking with Brewers about a faceplated box and I was told they could ship me one out. Not sure if "they" do it or send the parts out and assemble themselves. I was told it comes with billet steel bearing retainer, steel shift forks, upgraded side cover with 3/8" bolts instead of the standard 5/16". 1st gear is still syncrowed. My only concern is downshifting on the highway. Any one have any experience doing it?
1975abody
Well-Known Member
I've been driving mine everyday 70 mile round trip to work. For upshifting my combo, I let the motor fall to an idle, and for downshifting I double clutch and give the throttle a blip and it drops right in without any noise.
1975abody
Well-Known Member
I doubt Brewers is performing the mods in house. My guess is they are having Libertys do it for them.
Wish I would have know that Brewers offered that option. It's not on their website.
Would be curious to know what they charge.
Thanks for sharing
I am a 4 speed owner and love it. I grown up, the only way was to power shift it when beating on it. Hold the gas to the floor and shift as fast as you can, any other way was called granny shifting. lol (Growing up was alway a competition who can shift the fastest) Someone said tires never stop spinning, that was always the goal and was super hard to do. My Brother was the master, you think his car was an automatic. I always said he was not human and was part of the car to that so fast.
I do keep 4 speeds in stock, not all can take this abuse. Its not alway the intervals that brake. I have actually ripped the shifter off the tail shaft mount taps and had to change the tail shaft. But I am getting older and not as strong.lol
So my question is how will this help? Does this make everything stronger? Can you shift this set up without the clutch with the gas to the floor?
I am a 4 speed owner and love it. I grown up, the only way was to power shift it when beating on it. Hold the gas to the floor and shift as fast as you can, any other way was called granny shifting. lol (Growing up was alway a competition who can shift the fastest) Someone said tires never stop spinning, that was always the goal and was super hard to do. My Brother was the master, you think his car was an automatic. I always said he was not human and was part of the car to that so fast.
I do keep 4 speeds in stock, not all can take this abuse. Its not alway the intervals that brake. I have actually ripped the shifter off the tail shaft mount taps and had to change the tail shaft. But I am getting older and not as strong.lol
So my question is how will this help? Does this make everything stronger? Can you shift this set up without the clutch with the gas to the floor?
I was quoted $1895 plus shipping. Saw a post from Brewers on Fakebook that they offer faceplating.
Last edited:
440farmer
Member
Hello I have one in my car - Liberty told me to use the clutch. works flawlessly for goin on 3 years.
67Dart273
Well-Known Member
Actually dropping the cluster in the bottom IS an assembly procedure, "I've forgotten." I believe the 18 spline boxes require it, and the OD units. I recently assembled an OD box that was an oddball---A833 OD mated to a factory adapter to marry to a transfer case in a GM application.
I used a chuck of 5/8 heater hose for an arbor LOL
I used a chuck of 5/8 heater hose for an arbor LOL
mhuppertz
Well-Known Member
This is mostly irrelevant to the topic, but I have an NV4500 in my '95 Dodge W250, making rowdy power in the Cummins, can do a few no lift speed shifts before the pressure plate begs for mercy trying to clamp down 40 psi of boost, broke two Dana 70's until I stuck in a Detroit Locker... Not the same as keeping the gas mashed and blipping the clutch like a dog box, bit still really fast shifting. With my 833 had those big Kevlar conical synchros like the 4500! To the topic, really nice work, thanks for the tutorial. I didn't know they had upgraded the dog box "grind every other one off" slick shift stuff, very good to know.
Rolling_Thunder
Rolling Thunder
I found a broom handle that was just the right size... so now I have a short broom to sweep with haha
abdywgn
dismantler
Rolling_Thunder, thanks! piece of dowel rod would work. gonna look next time at Menard's.
1975abody
Well-Known Member
Depends on a lot of things..clutch,horsepower, weight etc. good question for Libertys..
mcodecuda
Senior Member
I actually used a piece of 3/4” conduit for an arbor and it worked perfectly.
yellow rose
Overnight Sensation
The right clutch will break anything. BTDT. If you don’t have a clutch, you need to call Rob at Advanced Clutches or Cale at Black Magic Clutches and buy one from them.
Get a data logger so you can monitor engine RPM/driveline speed and other important stuff.
Data. Got to have it. Ya I know more $$$. 20k just flashed in my face. I guess I'm going to have to sell one of mine to make this happen.
What do you disagree with.
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