FiTech EFI system

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I also experience starting and dying after a second only when it's really hot. If I'm driving it, and then pull into a store for a minute. And then get back in it, it will start and then die. But if it's cold, it will start and run no problems. I was thinking it might be heat related, and thus related to the FCC mounted in the really hot engine compartment and vaporizing the fuel in the canister.
 
Thanks for the input guys. The issue always points back to the ecu. Dropping the IAC to below 10 has helped the hot starts. Got the Coronet started last night - had to do a system recal - second time I've had to blow out the cal and re-input. Using the Tach function. Upside is that I can do the entire process in less than 10 minutes.
All connections are crimped, soldered, and shrink wrapped. Not getting any ign fault codes.
I'm seeing now that these EFI systems need to be fine tuned to dial them in. And I'm OK with that, I just wish the manufacturers were more forthright in their marketing campaigns because I bought in to the plug-n-play ads.
This thread has been a huge help and seeing the success members like SalC have had on their installs keeps me going.
 
rednesss said:
I also experience starting and dying after a second only when it's really hot. If I'm driving it, and then pull into a store for a minute. And then get back in it, it will start and then die. But if it's cold, it will start and run no problems. I was thinking it might be heat related, and thus related to the FCC mounted in the really hot engine compartment and vaporizing the fuel in the canister.
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Check your IAC steps at warm idle - it's under the Dashboard menu on the handheld. Mine originally was in the 50's, needs to be between 3 -10. Have to turn the idle air screw at the drivers side front of the TB clockwise to lower. Do it with the engine off, then start and check the reading at operating temp idle. Adjusts all have to be made with the engine off.
I'm not as concerned about the canister but I wonder about vapor lock between the mech fuel pump and canister. One of my winter projects is to re-route the line to a cooler spot.
 
What I have done is once I get the default tune setup and run for a few miles is to save that cal, plugged into the computer I rename one of the files to lets say basic.

Then I save the tune like after a few hundred miles and give it a name maybe basic200.

This way you can load and go in a few minutes with a tune that has some "learnin"

Larry
 
RBConvert said:
Check your IAC steps at warm idle - it's under the Dashboard menu on the handheld. Mine originally was in the 50's, needs to be between 3 -10. Have to turn the idle air screw at the drivers side front of the TB clockwise to lower. Do it with the engine off, then start and check the reading at operating temp idle. Adjusts all have to be made with the engine off.
I'm not as concerned about the canister but I wonder about vapor lock between the mech fuel pump and canister. One of my winter projects is to re-route the line to a cooler spot.
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My IAC's are right around 10 when warmed up. I've already adjusted them. One of my theories is that as all the gas boils off through the vent tube, an air pocket gets created in the high side fuel pump, then when I turn on the key, it fills the FCC can, then starts and there's an air pocket slug that gets to the TB and it dies. That's just a wild theory that I have. I'd like to get an in-tank set up some day.
 
What happens if the IAC count is lower?

When I had mine set to ~10 my idle screw was backed out almost all the way and my idle would be too low on cold starts, in fact it was hard to start. With the idle screw turned in a little more it idles much better but my IAC count bounces around 0 to 4. This seems to work better for me, just wondering if it's right?
 
SalC said:
What happens if the IAC count is lower?

When I had mine set to ~10 my idle screw was backed out almost all the way and my idle would be too low on cold starts, in fact it was hard to start. With the idle screw turned in a little more it idles much better but my IAC count bounces around 0 to 4. This seems to work better for me, just wondering if it's right?
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If it's low, that just means your min idle speed might be fast sometimes as the computer has no way to try and 'undershoot' your current idle speed. Verified no vacuum leaks? My engine will die if I turn the idle out that far.
 
rednesss said:
I also experience starting and dying after a second only when it's really hot. If I'm driving it, and then pull into a store for a minute. And then get back in it, it will start and then die. But if it's cold, it will start and run no problems. I was thinking it might be heat related, and thus related to the FCC mounted in the really hot engine compartment and vaporizing the fuel in the canister.
Click to expand...

There's a few things I've found that have an effect. First and foremost was interference with the ignition - I had an issue due to a burned wire and fixing that helped a heap.

The other has been the IAC open during crank. It's listed under idle control as 'CRANK IAC'. I had to up mine quite a bit to get it to fire off during hot restarts.
 
Phreakish said:
If it's low, that just means your min idle speed might be fast sometimes as the computer has no way to try and 'undershoot' your current idle speed. Verified no vacuum leaks? My engine will die if I turn the idle out that far.
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It's no longer backed out that far, when is was it idled fine as long as the engine was warmed up. When is was cold it was hard starting and would barely idle but the IAC count was ~10.

Now I have it set where the IAC hovers from 0-4 but it idles much better and starts fine. The idle is a bit faster upon startup and when I take it out of gear but after 15-20 seconds drops back down to normal. Is it ok with the IAC that low?
 
SalC said:
It's no longer backed out that far, when is was it idled fine as long as the engine was warmed up. When is was cold it was hard starting and would barely idle but the IAC count was ~10.

Now I have it set where the IAC hovers from 0-4 but it idles much better and starts fine. The idle is a bit faster upon startup and when I take it out of gear but after 15-20 seconds drops back down to normal. Is it ok with the IAC that low?
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I didn't like the idle at first either with the computer in full control, I had to turn down the learning.
What I noticed was the learn value for the fuel and IAC was jumping all over at idle. I reset my idle learn values under idle control. Then I turned down the "Idle fuel Learn rate" under 'AFR closed loop' menu. I put it down around 10. Then I set my loop up/down into the teens range (15 or so) and let the idle fuel stabilize a bit. I watched under the dashboard for the fuel learn number. Once it seemed to settle a bit, I turned the learn rate down to ~5 and upped the loop up/down on the idle back into the 20's. It got FAR more stable very fast.

Do this with the engine warmed up first, if you want to try it. Then let it idle a bit. I also played with the idle trim rates a bit in the closed loop AFR menu. These will be very different for every engine setup. Basically I just ran them way low, then way high and took notes, and zeroed in on what seemed to help most. The result was no longer seeing my IAC steps swing wildly from 0 to 20 and back while the AFR bounced from 9 to 15 and back. Now it idles with the AFR within .5 at the extremes, and the idle step will vary every 2~3 seconds instead of constantly.

I suggest watching the dashboard and data logging whenever you can. It really helps to watch the controls (fuel trims, IAC counts, AFR, etc) to see where extra work is needed to help speed up the 'self learning'.
 
Has anybody successfully controlled timing using a lean burn distributor? In this thread I see it's mentioned as a possible solution. Has anybody confirmed though?
 
that's great info Phreakish. My IAC counts bounce between 3 - ~15; going to try your suggestions.
BTW, did you get this info from FiTech or did you have previous experience tuning EFI? And now I'm wondering if FiTech is more a tuner product than the other brands, because I know a few FBBO members that have the FAST system and they didn't have to fine tune anywhere near as much as this system. The flip side, FAST users had more install issues, mostly related to ignition noise interference.
 
Phreakish said:
I didn't like the idle at first either with the computer in full control, I had to turn down the learning.
What I noticed was the learn value for the fuel and IAC was jumping all over at idle. I reset my idle learn values under idle control. Then I turned down the "Idle fuel Learn rate" under 'AFR closed loop' menu. I put it down around 10. Then I set my loop up/down into the teens range (15 or so) and let the idle fuel stabilize a bit. I watched under the dashboard for the fuel learn number. Once it seemed to settle a bit, I turned the learn rate down to ~5 and upped the loop up/down on the idle back into the 20's. It got FAR more stable very fast.

Do this with the engine warmed up first, if you want to try it. Then let it idle a bit. I also played with the idle trim rates a bit in the closed loop AFR menu. These will be very different for every engine setup. Basically I just ran them way low, then way high and took notes, and zeroed in on what seemed to help most. The result was no longer seeing my IAC steps swing wildly from 0 to 20 and back while the AFR bounced from 9 to 15 and back. Now it idles with the AFR within .5 at the extremes, and the idle step will vary every 2~3 seconds instead of constantly.

I suggest watching the dashboard and data logging whenever you can. It really helps to watch the controls (fuel trims, IAC counts, AFR, etc) to see where extra work is needed to help speed up the 'self learning'.
Click to expand...

This might be great information to put on the FiTech EFI Tuning tips thread.

Travis
 
If anyone is interested, I started a thread on a fitech dual quad setup on a edelbrock str12 crossram on a small block stroker...gonna be interesting!
 
If anyone is interested, one of the guys over on the dodgecharger.com forum is making some fuel pucks, they fit into the tanks inc tanks and take a readily available warlbro or aeromotive pump, a little bit cheaper than the Aeromotive retro fit system.

An Error Has Occurred!
 
RBConvert said:
that's great info Phreakish. My IAC counts bounce between 3 - ~15; going to try your suggestions.
BTW, did you get this info from FiTech or did you have previous experience tuning EFI? And now I'm wondering if FiTech is more a tuner product than the other brands, because I know a few FBBO members that have the FAST system and they didn't have to fine tune anywhere near as much as this system. The flip side, FAST users had more install issues, mostly related to ignition noise interference.
Click to expand...

I haven't spoken with FiTech at all.

I don't find the amount of setup cumbersome at all. My engine is a pain in the rear - 318 with too much cam, lots of stall, tall gear, and I live in the desert.. I wouldn't expect any system to work right out of the box.

I'm familiar with EFI systems, but have never tuned before. I did some logging and whenever I realized something was going on that I didn't like, I would focus on it gather data around that issue and then look at what was changing and impacting that specific thing. For example, the idle issue I noticed the learn values bouncing a lot. That clued me in. The system was well on it's way to learning, but I'm a tinkerer - I kept changing the idle setting, ignition timing, etc. Every change throws the system for a loop and can cause some teething pains, but I can't help myself. I noticed that a decent learn value around the idle rpms is pretty easy to establish quickly on a warm engine - and since there's plenty of idling to be had, a very low learn value tends to help keep it from overshooting in either direction while keeping variability low.

I had a bad tach signal for a while too, and even had my pickup at the distributor wired backwards for a while - caused all kinds of drama. The signal issue turned out to be a burned (damn header) wire. The backward wiring was making it impossible to start warm, and even before I switched to the timing control on the FiTech, the signal to the EFI wasn't working near as well.
 
Aussiemopars said:
If anyone is interested, one of the guys over on the dodgecharger.com forum is making some fuel pucks, they fit into the tanks inc tanks and take a readily available warlbro or aeromotive pump, a little bit cheaper than the Aeromotive retro fit system.

An Error Has Occurred!
Click to expand...
I used the tanks inc tank with there matching fuel pump. It is a warlbro pump.
 
I got the iac count down from the 120's as it was out of the box to the 8's. idles way better now. how about the IAC counts when its running? what should it be. I am having issues with the idle comming down to 800 very very slowly. my cruising iac counts are pretty high would this have anything to do with it? and how would I fix this if it is an issue thanks

Answered my own question with some trial and error. Have to turn on pro-tuning to have the ability to adjust the speed at which the system returns to idle
 
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So this happened to me today. The burned to a crisp pin is the constant 12v. Not sure what caused this, but when smoke started coming out of it I kinda got worried. I ended up cutting the wire out of the plug and running it around it. Seems to work ok still. I wonder if there was just a bad connection which caused resistance and then a bunch of heat.

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At least you caught it before it did too much damage. Looks like a connector problem to me. Like you did it arced and got hot
 
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