Jeff's 727 rebuild thread

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FWIW we went with the 3.8 lever and 12 springs also. Our research found exactly what kickdown just stated. That's the general consensus.

Ours is all together. Just need to do the valvebody on Sunday. Our clutch packs were at about .048 for both if I remember correctly.
 
prorac1 said:
FWIW we went with the 3.8 lever and 12 springs also. Our research found exactly what kickdown just stated. That's the general consensus.

Ours is all together. Just need to do the valvebody on Sunday. Our clutch packs were at about .048 for both if I remember correctly.
Click to expand...
If I didn't have to freakin' work.....this thing would be done already!
LOL.....!

3.8:1 with 12.....seems popular!

Jeff
 
Ok.....got my new tailshaft seal - exact match to the original. ..
The red one on the left came in the rebuild kit. ...


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Got out my new clutches and steels, soaking the clutches overnight and tomorrow morning I'll reassemble that drum....

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Jeff
 
MrJLR said:
Right on......I'll be putting that drum together tomorrow!

Jeff
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Jeff, pay particular attention to the piston seal lip when you fit the piston into it's bore. You cant get a lip wizard in there like you can with the forward clutch piston & great care has to be taken not to roll the seal lip over the chamfer in the drum. It has to slide down the chamfer & into it's bore. I find the chamfer is a little too shallow, but with a little patience the piston normally drops in fine without too much fuss. The secret is to use lots of assembly grease/Vaseline/ATF to lube the seal lip & the chamfer. Dont be shy with the lube. You'll see what I mean when you get round to fitting the piston.
Cheers. Gaz.
 
KickDown said:
Jeff, pay particular attention to the piston seal lip when you fit the piston into it's bore. You cant get a lip wizard in there like you can with the forward clutch piston & great care has to be taken not to roll the seal lip over the chamfer in the drum. It has to slide down the chamfer & into it's bore. I find the chamfer is a little too shallow, but with a little patience the piston normally drops in fine without too much fuss. The secret is to use lots of assembly grease/Vaseline/ATF to lube the seal lip & the chamfer. Dont be shy with the lube. You'll see what I mean when you get round to fitting the piston.
Cheers. Gaz.
Click to expand...

Good advice. ....that seal looks like it could be difficult. .....
When I gently removed it, the seal was torn and falling apart...I suspect it was one of the problems I was having with the transmission. ....

Jeff
 
Yes I've had countless cases where the high/rev clutch outer piston seal was damaged. This is nearly always the case with a 30 - 40 year old transmission. A good indication of this is that the friction plates are completely toast & the steels are discolored or even warped into a sort of Belleville spring shape.
 
KickDown said:
Yes I've had countless cases where the high/rev clutch outer piston seal was damaged. This is nearly always the case with a 30 - 40 year old transmission. A good indication of this is that the friction plates are completely toast & the steels are discolored or even warped into a sort of Belleville spring shape.
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Just waiting for the sun to come up. ....!
This is the fun part. ...reassembly!

Jeff
 
Ok....got a question. ..
I stacked 4 steels and 4 clutches - same number as it had, added the pressure plate and snap ring....
I have .215" of clearance. ...I heard .150" is the max.....

Do I add another steel and Clutch or??????

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I will let the others chime in, but I say that if you can and still maintain your proper clearance then yes. Some of the aftermarket kits have thinner clutches and / or steels for this exact reason.
 
Ok Jeff. I like to see between 0.012 - 0.015 per friction plate. That means if you have 4 frictions in there, you are looking for a clutch clearance of 0.048 - 0.060. If you have 5 in there then aim for 0.060 - 0.075. The large retaining ring is a selective. It is available in 6 different thickness to enable an accurate clutch end play setting. There are also thin frictions available in 0.061 thickness. Looking at your drum you will be able to get 5 thins in there.
 
KickDown said:
Ok Jeff. I like to see between 0.012 - 0.015 per friction plate. That means if you have 4 frictions in there, you are looking for a clutch clearance of 0.048 - 0.060. If you have 5 in there then aim for 0.060 - 0.075. The large retaining ring is a selective. It is available in 6 different thickness to enable an accurate clutch end play setting. There are also thin frictions available in 0.061 thickness. Looking at your drum you will be able to get 5 thins in there.
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Ok....I'll go with 5 and order more for the other clutch pack....thanks!

Check out the warpage on this steel!

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Jeff
 
Called Summit Racing and they're gonna send out the extra clutches and steels FREE.....

Great customer service

Jeff
 
Ok....I added one more clutch and one more steel and now, with 5 of each, I have .068" clearance. ....good????

Jeff
 
Ok....told you I had lots of questions!
The bushing in the shaft that goes through the pump.....
I have two candidates in my kit....
A split one and a solid one.
I think I should use the solid one, but want to be sure.

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There's actually 3 bushings that are candidates for this in my kit.....
And the ***** is, to remove the bushing, I'm going to have to cut it most of the way out on a lathe because it bottoms out on a shoulder in the shaft....

I have some measuring to do. ..!

Jeff
 
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Use which ever one fits the Journal on the input shaft best. Then drive it in to the correct depth. Chuck the reaction shaft support in the lathe & increase the size of the chamfer to that of the old bushing. This will prevent damage to the input shaft sealing rings when you drop the pump in.
 
KickDown said:
Use which ever one fits the Journal on the input shaft best. Then drive it in to the correct depth. Chuck the reaction shaft support in the lathe & increase the size of the chamfer to that of the old bushing. This will prevent damage to the input shaft sealing rings when you drop the pump in.
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Looks like the split bushing fits real nice on the input shaft. ....good tip on that chamfer!

Jeff
 
Jeff I saw you were asking opinions above and mentioned me. I agree with the 12 springs in the high clutch and the clearance Gaz suggested. Were all the clutch discs in the kit the same thickness? From the factory they used thicker discs in the high clutch. If they all were the thin style like the rear clutch used and you got 5 of each in the high clutch with .068" clearance your good to go with a bonus of more clutch surface area. BTW: use a little medium strength loctite on that split bushing in the stator so it stays in place
 
MrJLR said:
Ok....I'll go with 5 and order more for the other clutch pack....thanks!

Check out the warpage on this steel!
Jeff
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Yes Sir!!. That clutch got very hot! After you mentioned the high/rev clutch piston seal was damaged & fell apart when you removed the piston, you know the reason why that clutch got so hot. A slipping clutch generates an insane amount of heat very fast & with the friction material being an impregnated paper base, it's toast in seconds. If you have wondered why there are smooth frictions & frictions with a waffle or slotted pattern, the smooth frictions are fitted to the forward clutch & the waffle frictions go in the high/rev clutch. Why? Because the high/rev clutch is a so called shifting clutch & the forward clutch is permanently engaged when ever the transmission is in a forward gear. The waffle pattern helps dissipate the trans fluid quicker when the high/rev clutch releases.
 
fishy68 said:
Jeff I saw you were asking opinions above and mentioned me. I agree with the 12 springs in the high clutch and the clearance Gaz suggested. Were all the clutch discs in the kit the same thickness? From the factory they used thicker discs in the high clutch. If they all were the thin style like the rear clutch used and you got 5 of each in the high clutch with .068" clearance your good to go with a bonus of more clutch surface area. BTW: use a little medium strength loctite on that split bushing in the stator so it stays in place
Click to expand...

Thank you!
Yes...all the clutches in the kit are the same thin ones.....all are the smooth style too...
Are you talking about the 2 rings on the reaction shaft? Put a dab of Loctite on the ends of those?

Jeff
 
KickDown said:
Yes Sir!!. That clutch got very hot! After you mentioned the high/rev clutch piston seal was damaged & fell apart when you removed the piston, you know the reason why that clutch got so hot. A slipping clutch generates an insane amount of heat very fast & with the friction material being an impregnated paper base, it's toast in seconds. If you have wondered why there are smooth frictions & frictions with a waffle or slotted pattern, the smooth frictions are fitted to the forward clutch & the waffle frictions go in the high/rev clutch. Why? Because the high/rev clutch is a so called shifting clutch & the forward clutch is permanently engaged when ever the transmission is in a forward gear. The waffle pattern helps dissipate the trans fluid quicker when the high/rev clutch releases.
Click to expand...

Thanks!
All the frictions in the kit are the smooth ones....is that a bad thing? Should I get the waffle style?

Jeff
 
Not really necessary. Thats how the transmission was put together at the plant. It's not noticeable while driving. Tracy meant you to put a smear of Loctite on the back of the bushing you pressed into the reaction shaft support to keep it in place. Dont put Loctite anywhere near the sealing rings. The ends are just hooked into each other.
 
KickDown said:
Not really necessary. Thats how the transmission was put together at the plant. It's not noticeable while driving. Tracy meant you to put a smear of Loctite on the back of the bushing you pressed into the reaction shaft support to keep it in place. Dont put Loctite anywhere near the sealing rings. The ends are just hooked into each other.
Click to expand...
Ok.....on the bushing. ...that makes sense!
Thanks.....

When the sun comes up I'm going back to work on it!

Jeff
 
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