picture of inside of a Pertronix dist.

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22dog22

22dog22

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Can anyone supply a photo of the inside of a Pertronix Ignitor II dist. , is there a whiteish cover over the center shaft that is the trigger point for the module? The person at tech. support, said that there should be one, however I am having so many problems with mine, I will pull it out and go with an OEM Mopar type electronic system from Ricks Mopar. Have a 318 69 Cuda, with high dome pistons, Comp. Cam, Alum. intake, ITT headers, 904 auto trans.

As a 2nd question, if I have #1 cylinder [compression] at 10deg. before TDC, and have the rotor pointing to #1 cylinder, is this ok, and just set timing with a timing light from there? OR is needed to be #1 cylinder at TDC, to install the dist. with rotor at #1 and then adjust with the timing light?
 
22dog22 said:
Can anyone supply a photo of the inside of a Pertronix Ignitor II dist. , is there a whiteish cover over the center shaft that is the trigger point for the module? The person at tech. support, said that there should be one, however I am having so many problems with mine, I will pull it out and go with an OEM Mopar type electronic system from Ricks Mopar. Have a 318 69 Cuda, with high dome pistons, Comp. Cam, Alum. intake, ITT headers, 904 auto trans.

As a 2nd question, if I have #1 cylinder [compression] at 10deg. before TDC, and have the rotor pointing to #1 cylinder, is this ok, and just set timing with a timing light from there? OR is needed to be #1 cylinder at TDC, to install the dist. with rotor at #1 and then adjust with the timing light?
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any information?
 
22dog22 said:
any information?
Click to expand...

I have a Pertronix II installed in my '65 FS 273 factory dual point distributor, and am attaching photos. Hope they can be of help. This is a "lobe sensing" type. Bob

DSC_7112.JPG
DSC_7113.JPG
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DSC_7115.JPG
DSC_7116.JPG
 
Some earlier Ignitors had magnets embedded in a white plastic collar around the shaft below the rotor.
 
Thank you for the photos, I see you have the Ignitor II installed in what looks like a OEM Mopar dist., I have the Pertronix unit dist. with the Ignitor II installed and on the center shaft , a white/transparent , plastic item that covers the armature of what the module would ride against . Looking a photo of that area or let me know if it should be there.

DSCN0121.JPG
 
22dog22 said:
Thank you for the photos, I see you have the Ignitor II installed in what looks like a OEM Mopar dist., I have the Pertronix unit dist. with the Ignitor II installed and on the center shaft , a white/transparent , plastic item that covers the armature of what the module would ride against . Looking a photo of that area or let me know if it should be there.

View attachment 1716300402
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Yes, my Pertronix Ignitor II is installed in my stock dual point distributor. I wish I could help but I am not familiar with what you have there.
 
Looking at the pics in post #3, has put Pertronix on my 'Do not buy list'.
That design, triggering off the high point [ which is not very high...or pointed ] would have cyl to cyl timing variations.
 
22dog22 said:
Thank you for the photos, I see you have the Ignitor II installed in what looks like a OEM Mopar dist., I have the Pertronix unit dist. with the Ignitor II installed and on the center shaft , a white/transparent , plastic item that covers the armature of what the module would ride against . Looking a photo of that area or let me know if it should be there.

View attachment 1716300402
Click to expand...

I’ve got an Pertronix billet distributor in my Duster, I can grab a picture for you although it might take day or two as I’m at work and don’t like to open things up in a parking lot when I’m 60+ miles from home.

You didn’t actually say though, what problems are you having? Are you running the proper resistance coil as well? You’ve bypassed or removed the ballast resistor?

For your timing question, put #1 at TDC and then install the distributor with the rotor pointing at #1. Worry about the advance after the distributor is installed and adjust with a timing light.

Bewy said:
Looking at the pics in post #3, has put Pertronix on my 'Do not buy list'.
That design, triggering off the high point [ which is not very high...or pointed ] would have cyl to cyl timing variations.
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Ah, so you’ve never run one and never tested one, but you know better than the manufacturer does?

First, there are several different Pertronix ignition conversion kits, and they use different triggering methods. So not liking the lobe triggered version above doesn’t mean you can’t use a different pertronix unit.

Second, the lobe triggered Pertronix units have a micro controller that adjusts the spark timing.

DODGE PerTronix 91385LS PerTronix Ignitor II® Lobe Sensor Solid-State Ignition Systems | Summit Racing

I mean, it’s almost like people smart enough to design that ignition unit would understand how to trigger it reliably. And maybe a guy on the internet that saw a few pictures and jumped to conclusions isn’t an expert in the matter.
 
I agree the Pertronix stuff is good. The only reason I'm not running it is because of parts availability if something breaks. I have gobs of Mopar stuff, so that's what I run.
 
RustyRatRod said:
I agree the Pertronix stuff is good. The only reason I'm not running it is because of parts availability if something breaks. I have gobs of Mopar stuff, so that's what I run.
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Honestly I think your odds of finding a Petronix unit at a local parts house are probably better than finding a Mopar ignition box these days. And if you’re gonna carry a spare it doesn’t really matter.
 
@22dog22 , here's some pictures of my Pertronix billet distributor with the ignitor II unit. Appears to have the same plastic collar as yours, I would be willing to bet the dark spots on mine is dirt stuck to the magnetic triggers embedded in the plastic.

IMG_7779.jpeg


IMG_7775.jpeg
 
Bob Jasinski said:
I have a Pertronix II installed in my '65 FS 273 factory dual point distributor, and am attaching photos. Hope they can be of help. This is a "lobe sensing" type. Bob

View attachment 1716300330View attachment 1716300331View attachment 1716300332View attachment 1716300333View attachment 1716300334
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So looking at my distributor, can you tell me this will fit? My tag was missing but fairly sure I have the original cast iron dual points distributor in my 1965 Barracuda, 273 four barrel. IBS-4013 I believe. I bought a 1381A ignitor, didn't fit. Seems I need something different for a dual point. As you can see I've removed the top plate. Still not sure how this will fit in my distributor.

If I was to ditch the original distributor, could I buy pretty much anything to drop in if I plan to run an ignitor? Even a single point? I've looked at small block distributors from $60 to $300, including a nice one on blueprint engines. Not sure if quality is the main concern if I'm ditching the points anyway.

I see you have a tan cap. I've seen this argued before. 1965 commando engine, black or tan from factory? Mine was black when I got the car, so plan to stick with black.

Thanks!

IMG_1414.jpg
 
I have the Pertronix Ignitor II, 91385LS installed in the stock dual point IBS 4013 dist. No problem with installing it, seemed to fit just fine. The engine is not in car yet, not been started, so I can't comment on how it performs.

Below scans are from page 35, Road & Track April 1965, (full page and a close up). Even though this is a black and white photo, the scan indicates the '65 FS 273 came with a tan dist. cap from how light it appears, (similar to washer bottle). You can also see the small hose (painted red) is a different shade than the black radiator hose above it.

65 FS R&T pg 35 4-1965-2.jpg



65 FS R&T pg 35 4-1965-1.jpg
 
72bluNblu said:
Honestly I think your odds of finding a Petronix unit at a local parts house are probably better than finding a Mopar ignition box these days. And if you’re gonna carry a spare it doesn’t really matter.
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Well then LOL don't do either. I run Mopar distributors and GM HEI modules. I even used one on the Toyota 20R I stuck in the old cletrac. It had a distributor, but no module when I got it. And I sure wish I had the room and had it back LOL

IMG_8500cs.JPG
 
Bob Jasinski said:
I have the Pertronix Ignitor II, 91385LS installed in the stock dual point IBS 4013 dist. No problem with installing it, seemed to fit just fine. The engine is not in car yet, not been started, so I can't comment on how it performs.

Below scans are from page 35, Road & Track April 1965, (full page and a close up). Even though this is a black and white photo, the scan indicates the '65 FS 273 came with a tan dist. cap from how light it appears, (similar to washer bottle). You can also see the small hose (painted red) is a different shade than the black radiator hose above it.

View attachment 1716334082


View attachment 1716334081
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Bob Jasinski said:
I have the Pertronix Ignitor II, 91385LS installed in the stock dual point IBS 4013 dist. No problem with installing it, seemed to fit just fine. The engine is not in car yet, not been started, so I can't comment on how it performs.

Below scans are from page 35, Road & Track April 1965, (full page and a close up). Even though this is a black and white photo, the scan indicates the '65 FS 273 came with a tan dist. cap from how light it appears, (similar to washer bottle). You can also see the small hose (painted red) is a different shade than the black radiator hose above it.

View attachment 1716334082


View attachment 1716334081
Click to expand...
Thanks for the info. I'll give 91385LS a shot. even though Pertronix website says it won't fit my 65. My engine is coming out on 12/9, figure it's a good time to do some upgrades.

I wonder if different setups had different color caps. I have the original air cleaner with the CAP nipple, I notice this car is a closed canister.
 
73Charger318 said:
Thanks for the info. I'll give 91385LS a shot. even though Pertronix website says it won't fit my 65. My engine is coming out on 12/9, figure it's a good time to do some upgrades.

I wonder if different setups had different color caps. I have the original air cleaner with the CAP nipple, I notice this car is a closed canister.
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This is confusing. I bought the 91385LS from Summit in Jan 2023. It's still listed on Summit for a '65 Barracuda 273,

www.summitracing.com

1965 PLYMOUTH BARRACUDA PerTronix 91385LS PerTronix Ignitor II® Lobe Sensor Solid-State Ignition Systems | Summit Racing

Free Shipping - PerTronix Ignitor II® Lobe Sensor Solid-State Ignition Systems with qualifying orders of $109. Shop Electronic Distributor Conversion Kits at Summit Racing.
www.summitracing.com www.summitracing.com

it fit my stock IBS 4013 just fine. Not sure why Pertronix isn't listing it. Maybe they've dropped that model from the line, I hope mine works well, I'll soon see.

As far as the dist. cap color, I know of no other mag article from the period to show the engine from the angle that you can see the cap. I do have the this from the Jan '65 Motor Trend, it shows the Clean Air Package package, but not the distributor. I don't see any reason the CAP would use a different color distributor cap, a different assembly plant maybe. I found my tan cap on eBay for a reasonable price, I think around $45.

7773.jpg
 
Bob Jasinski said:
This is confusing. I bought the 91385LS from Summit in Jan 2023. It's still listed on Summit for a '65 Barracuda 273,

www.summitracing.com

1965 PLYMOUTH BARRACUDA PerTronix 91385LS PerTronix Ignitor II® Lobe Sensor Solid-State Ignition Systems | Summit Racing

Free Shipping - PerTronix Ignitor II® Lobe Sensor Solid-State Ignition Systems with qualifying orders of $109. Shop Electronic Distributor Conversion Kits at Summit Racing.
www.summitracing.com www.summitracing.com

it fit my stock IBS 4013 just fine. Not sure why Pertronix isn't listing it. Maybe they've dropped that model from the line, I hope mine works well, I'll soon see.

As far as the dist. cap color, I know of no other mag article from the period to show the engine from the angle that you can see the cap. I do have the this from the Jan '65 Motor Trend, it shows the Clean Air Package package, but not the distributor. I don't see any reason the CAP would use a different color distributor cap, a different assembly plant maybe. I found my tan cap on eBay for a reasonable price, I think around $45.

View attachment 1716334135
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Yes, summit says it fits. Pertronix website has its listed, out of stock, and says it doesn't fit. I did send them a message about it in chat. I see a 1385LS on Amazon for less money. I'm assuming this is an older model and the 91385LS is the new model? No idea. Pertronix part numbers are pretty confusing.

Possibly the formula S mattered on cap color. Or even four speed vs auto? No idea. I have a pretty new black one from Napa and I'm going to call it correct for now. lol
 
The tan material (glass-filled alkyd) was an upgrade from the black material (phenolic resin, "bakelite"); it is less water-permeable and has higher dielectric strength. That is why Chrysler phased in the tan caps across ~all applications in the '64-'65 timeframe. No TSBs that I've ever seen, but enough better to comport with "The policy of Chrysler Corporation is one of continual product improvement; specifications are subject to change without notice".

Whether any given car got a black cap or a tan one was down to what was in stock/came to hand when a particular distributor was being built. You can follow the part number supersessions for any given type of cap through the years, and it goes black-black-black-tan-tan-tan. The next material change was in the mid-late '80s, when glass-filled thermoplastic caps began to replace the alkyd ones, for the same reasons (plus thermoplastic was cheaper, and easier to ventilate in a splash-resistant manner).
 
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slantsixdan said:
The tan material (glass-filled alkyd) was an upgrade from the black material (bakelite); it is less water-permeable and has higher dielectric strength. That is why Chrysler phased in the tan caps across all applications in the '64-'65 timeframe, on ~all engines. Not enough of an improvement to warrant any TSBs that I've ever seen, but enough to comport with "The policy of Chrysler Corporation is one of continual product improvement. Specifications are subject to change without notice".

Whether any given car got a black cap or a tan one was down to what was in stock/came to hand when a particular distributor was being built. You can follow the part number supersessions for any given type of cap through the years, and it goes black-black-black-black-tan-tan-tan. The next material change was in the mid-late '80s, when glass-filled thermoplastic caps began to replace the alkyd ones, for the same reasons (plus thermoplastic was cheaper).
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Great information Dan, this is the first I've heard about the reason for the change in color, thanks for posting.
 
73Charger318 said:
So per Pertronix this morning they say for the IBS-4013 distributor I should be using Pertronix 1584.


Summit says this is for an IBS-4012. Speedway has it on sale but says it may not fit. Anyone know the difference between and IBS-4012 and an IBS-4013? Anyone ever use this particular Pertronix conversion kit?

Thanks!
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I'm confused as well, and a bit concerned. The 91385LS fit fine in my original dual point IBS 4013, as shown in post #3. As mentioned, the engine has not yet been fired up, although it should be within 3 months or so. If it does not work properly, I hope Summit will work with me to get the correct unit, it was purchased in Jan 2023.
 
I would think if it fit it should function correctly. Just thought I would share what Pertronix told me today. They said according to their information the same unit fits an IBS-4012 and the IBS-4013. I'm still concerned with mine also. If you look at the picture of the inside of my distributor I don't see anywhere that this unit or any unit could be screwed down. Good luck when you fire it up!
 
IBS-4012: Prestolite dual-point distributor for a Studebaker V8.
IBS-4013: Prestolite dual-point distributor for a Chrysler V8.

Same cap. Same rotor. Different points, though. Can't tell for sure from the pics I'm finding online whether the one set of points would mount correctly in place of the other—looks like maybe or not! Sorry I can't be definitively helpful.

That said, the points that fit the IBS-4013 (Standard/Bluestreak AL-5486P, Echlin CS729A) also fit the 413 in a '65 Imperial, also the '60-'67 Jeep CJ6, and all the rest of the many applications listed under the vehicle-fitment tab here, so that ought to provide some cross-check fodder for Pertronix fitment.
 
Now the same guy at Pertronix that said 1584 fit says they don't offer a conversion kit for the IBS-4013 specifically. (Anthony). Even Pertronix reps have no idea what works and what doesn't. I think I'm back to trying the #91385LS since I've seen it fit in an IBS-4013 distributor.
 
I spoke with Jeremy today at Pertronix, he checked with engineering and called me back. He said the 91385LS (the 9 at the beginning indicates Ignitor II by the way) is correct for my IBS-4013 distributor. He said to make sure the correct rotor direction (clockwise for 273) is selected in the mounting plate (edit) pin, as mentioned in the installation instructions, which I did. He also had me confirm the distance from the tip of the lobe to the face of the module, and I measured .030", which he said was the "sweet spot", but he also said it will work with less or more distance, but no more than .050". Evidently this is the newer offering for this application and they are updating things on their end.
 
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