Streetmaster to Airgap

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PRH said:
I have no idea how much power 302 heads can ultimately make.

What I do know is they can certainly make 293hp.
Cuz I’ve done that.

When you get your car into the 11’s with your 302 heads, then you’ll know absolutely positively it can be done.
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I already the know the answer to that. There's plenty of lower cube stuff locally that runs quicker with less head and less cubes and less comp than what I currently have. It doesn't take a genius to look at what I'm currently running and see what areas I can improve on.

Do you remember Jeff at Modern Cylinder Head? Would you say he was dishonest?
 
PRH said:
Then you should be all set.

For the record, I’m not trying to convince anyone of anything.
I’m just passing on info
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I should be when I get my short block back after waiting more than 12 months.

So too was I. But since what I passed on didn't fit certain peoples narratives then the stone throwing commenced but when I asked a simple question as to whether or not a 302 head "CAN" make the power to push a 3400 brick down the 1/4 in the 11's no one would answer the question.

Now why would it be so hard to answer that question? Its a simple YES or NO. Either the head can flow enough air to do it or it can't. So if your friends Pontiac can make the power its making with 200/220 cfm why cant a 302 head that flows the same do it?

Remember the set of 302's that Jeff at Modern did that were put up for sale at Moparts? He stated they could make 500hp and it would cost $2000 to replicate. That was still around 125 ccs from memory before going to a 1.88 for the buyer who beat me too them. So a head that's tiny in port volume with a tiny valve tiny a tiny port window can still have the potential to make 500 Hp. I don't have any of those limitations........

So what's it gonna be? Can a 302 head make the power or not. It might be easier to answer that question now for some folks now that some one more knowledgeable and experienced says it will.
 
Hysteric said:
Is that what you really think it would cost?
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What do you think it would cost to make a 302 head perform like a TF? The answer is you can’t. Simple as that. Why start with a turd and buff it? Why not start with something worth having? Is it because you want to show everyone your prowess? By all means, have at it. To argue for using that casting or any cast iron passenger car head rather than even the lowly Speedmaster head is a fools errand. Have a fun trip.
 
Hysteric said:
I should be when I get my short block back after waiting more than 12 months.

So too was I. But since what I passed on didn't fit certain peoples narratives then the stone throwing commenced but when I asked a simple question as to whether or not a 302 head "CAN" make the power to push a 3400 brick down the 1/4 in the 11's no one would answer the question.

Now why would it be so hard to answer that question? Its a simple YES or NO. Either the head can flow enough air to do it or it can't. So if your friends Pontiac can make the power its making with 200/220 cfm why cant a 302 head that flows the same do it?

Remember the set of 302's that Jeff at Modern did that were put up for sale at Moparts? He stated they could make 500hp and it would cost $2000 to replicate. That was still around 125 ccs from memory before going to a 1.88 for the buyer who beat me too them. So a head that's tiny in port volume with a tiny valve tiny a tiny port window can still have the potential to make 500 Hp. I don't have any of those limitations........

So what's it gonna be? Can a 302 head make the power or not. It might be easier to answer that question now for some folks now that some one more knowledgeable and experienced says it will.
Click to expand...


Well let’s see this 500 hp combo. Let’s see what it actually runs in the real world. And there is the 2k I said it would cost. 5k for a Stock or Super Stock head. Penny wise and pound foolish.
 
Rat Bastid said:
Would you spend 5k to make a 302 head make 420 hp or 2500 to make 480 hp,
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That's exactly what you said. Any other lies you'd like to tell? There's a big difference between 2K and 5K.

What's your next LIE or EXCUSE going to be?
 
For those who don't know who Jeff was or did:

Jeffrey T. Kobylski
Jeff graduated from Oakland University with a BS in biochemistry. He started porting cylinder heads back in 1991. He built heads for many NHRA Top Fuel racers: Kenny Bernstein, Don Prudhomme, Dean Skuza, and Roland Leong just to name a few. Modern Cylinder Head Incorporated was founded in 1996.

We port all types of heads from full blown race cars to mild street cars. One of our main avenue's is in the NHRA Super Stock and Comp Eliminator class. Many racers in these two classes run all Modern Cylinder Head products in their cars. There are many racers or just street enthusiast that run our cylinder heads, camshafts, and intake manifolds. Whether it's street driving or all out drag racing including the F.A.S.T (Factory Appearing Stock Tire) cars that run Modern Cylinder Head Parts, we can set you on the right track. MCH has some of the latest equipment to meet your needs.
 
Hysteric said:
So too was I. But since what I passed on didn't fit certain peoples narratives then the stone throwing commenced
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Bullshit. What you stated was that a 16hp gain for a manifold was in fact no gain, and obviously no swap was needed.

That's bullshit. Plain and simple.
 
Hysteric said:
For those who don't know who Jeff was or did:

Jeffrey T. Kobylski
Click to expand...

No one cares. You're not going to be the next him.

Your argument is moot. You want to start with a head, then completely change it to something else while still calling it what it was. Why not just cut everything else away except the 302 casting number and Weld a better head under it? It would take less time and money.. Sheesh.

You should name your car Theseus. But I'm sure it'll still be down 2-3 cylinders when it clicks off a 13.2 next year.
 
Ah ha...8 pages of this **** again.

Modern cyl head...looks like they get to be tossed under the bus by a no name chest beater asswipe hung up a heads with ports the size of whistles...I'm surprised they don't sing like a bird when on a running engine...what is it about this cat and 302 heads. It's been like this since day one on this site for him....he used to drag Dave Hughes name around and toss it under the bus..until the big mouth heads hit a wall and people came forth accusing Hughes of lying,inflating numbers..so I guess he abandoned that drop... So Hughes, then gtxjohn and now Jeff at modern. Okay.
Thing is...The heads are 125cc as cast.
No one did anything that make near the power without increasing that first..unless he did as another wipe said and welded on them. Not.
Theres nothing wrong with any of the other closed chamber 273/318 heads, they'll do the same thing a 302 head is capable of.

Maybe this should be.. let's hear why the other heads aren't just as bad ***...the 920,234,315...same port.
Entertain us...
 
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Phreakish said:
No one cares.
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You seem to care a lot though. Why is that?

The car ran 12.6 @ 107 but you can't bring yourself to accept it.

You still haven't answered the question.
 
Hysteric said:
You seem to care a lot though. Why is that?

The car ran 12.6 @ 107 but you can't bring yourself to accept it.

You still haven't answered the question.
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And it goes slower on fewer cylinders every time you touch it. Leave the poor car alone!

The question has been answered, you just don't like it. Have fun running 14s next year.
 
Hysteric said:
One of our main avenue's is in the NHRA Super Stock and Comp Eliminator class
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Here's a clue to why he can. There's a reason he can make power with 125 cc. He can make a head flow a lot of air with very little port volume.
 
Phreakish said:
And it goes slower on fewer cylinders every time you touch it. Leave the poor car alone!

The question has been answered, you just don't like it. Have fun running 14s next year.
Click to expand...

Still haven't answered the question have you.
 
We need some magazines to do dyno tests with them little pecker port heads to show this nincompoop ..since he takes their word as law.
 
Hysteric said:
Here's a clue to why he can. There's a reason he can make power with 125 cc. He can make a head flow a lot of air with very little port volume.
Click to expand...

I wish you knew what you were talking about.


125cc is as cast.

Even if you had something here...your info is wrong and therefore unconvincing
 
MOPAROFFICIAL said:
We need some magazines to do dyno tests with them little pecker port heads to show this nincompoop ..since he takes their word as law.
Click to expand...

Here's a list of the heads Modern does. Notice that they are at the top of the performance food chain.

Modern Cylinder Head Products
Mopar Cylinder Heads

Stage V Hemi
[standard and raised intake locations]
[standard and raised exhaust locations]
[millenium head (rotated exhaust valve)]
Aluminum "Street or Race" 110-M Hemi
Indy Legend Hemi 426-1R
Indy Legend Hemi 426-1RA
NHRA Super Stock Aluminum modified Hemi 110-M head
NHRA Super Stock Aluminum Hemi'65 110-M head
NHRA Super Stock Iron Hemi '64-'71 559-M head
Indy 440-1 Big Block
Mopar Aluminum Magnum small block
B1-Brodix small block NHRA super stock 308/576 small block 1.88/1.78-1.60/1.50
[standard intake port or moved intake port ]
NHRA 4.900 bore spaced Pro Stock Hemi


Ford Cylinder Heads

5.00 bore Spaced IHRA Pro Stock
4.6 Modular 4-Valve & pi 2-Valve
Iron BB Cobra Jet
Aluminum Motorsport A-428 CobraJet
Iron Ex514/A460 Big Block
Iron Big Block F3TE
Iron 4-BBL Cleveland NHRA Super Stock
Iron 4-BBL Cleveland All Out Race Head
Trick Flow Small Block "R" head
Trick Flow Small Block Twisted Wedge
Edelbrock Victor Jr.
Edelbrock Victor Sr.



Chevrolet Cylinder Heads

Dart 220 [std intake runner]
Dart 220 [raised intake runner]
Dart 220 [std exh location]
Dart 220 [spread exh location]
18 Degree GM head [large and small valve spacing]
LS1 Stage 1/2 Street Heads
LS1 NHRA super stock to fit stock intake manifold
LS1 NHRA super stock raised intake runner
LS6
LT1
LT4
Dart Pro-1 small block
NHRA super stock small block 462-041 1.94/1.50
NHRA super stock big block 840 2.19/1.72
Dart Pro-1 big block Brodix Big Brodie

Pontiac Cylinder Heads

Edelbrock Performer RPM [2.19 and 2.15 intake valve / 1.66 and 1.71 exhaust]

I cant wait for your next You Tube installment on which heads were they again.......
 
Hysteric said:
Here's a list of the heads Modern does. Notice that they are at the top of the performance food chain.

Modern Cylinder Head Products
Mopar Cylinder Heads

Stage V Hemi
[standard and raised intake locations]
[standard and raised exhaust locations]
[millenium head (rotated exhaust valve)]
Aluminum "Street or Race" 110-M Hemi
Indy Legend Hemi 426-1R
Indy Legend Hemi 426-1RA
NHRA Super Stock Aluminum modified Hemi 110-M head
NHRA Super Stock Aluminum Hemi'65 110-M head
NHRA Super Stock Iron Hemi '64-'71 559-M head
Indy 440-1 Big Block
Mopar Aluminum Magnum small block
B1-Brodix small block NHRA super stock 308/576 small block 1.88/1.78-1.60/1.50
[standard intake port or moved intake port ]
NHRA 4.900 bore spaced Pro Stock Hemi


Ford Cylinder Heads

5.00 bore Spaced IHRA Pro Stock
4.6 Modular 4-Valve & pi 2-Valve
Iron BB Cobra Jet
Aluminum Motorsport A-428 CobraJet
Iron Ex514/A460 Big Block
Iron Big Block F3TE
Iron 4-BBL Cleveland NHRA Super Stock
Iron 4-BBL Cleveland All Out Race Head
Trick Flow Small Block "R" head
Trick Flow Small Block Twisted Wedge
Edelbrock Victor Jr.
Edelbrock Victor Sr.



Chevrolet Cylinder Heads

Dart 220 [std intake runner]
Dart 220 [raised intake runner]
Dart 220 [std exh location]
Dart 220 [spread exh location]
18 Degree GM head [large and small valve spacing]
LS1 Stage 1/2 Street Heads
LS1 NHRA super stock to fit stock intake manifold
LS1 NHRA super stock raised intake runner
LS6
LT1
LT4
Dart Pro-1 small block
NHRA super stock small block 462-041 1.94/1.50
NHRA super stock big block 840 2.19/1.72
Dart Pro-1 big block Brodix Big Brodie

Pontiac Cylinder Heads

Edelbrock Performer RPM [2.19 and 2.15 intake valve / 1.66 and 1.71 exhaust]

I cant wait for your next You Tube installment on which heads were they again.......
Click to expand...

Then buy some and shut the **** up about it.
 
Hysteric said:
Here's a clue to why he can. There's a reason he can make power with 125 cc. He can make a head flow a lot of air with very little port volume.
Click to expand...

It's amazing what happens when you hog out a port, then machine the **** out of the intake side to pull the CCs back down, isn't it? That makes them no longer stock heads, too.

Might as well slap on a set of w2 heads and engrave "302" on them.

Comparing superstock and stock eliminator heads to factory casting is such a dishonest comparison that it renders you nothing more than a troll.
 
Hysteric said:
Here's a list of the heads Modern does. Notice that they are at the top of the performance food chain.

Modern Cylinder Head Products
Mopar Cylinder Heads

Stage V Hemi
[standard and raised intake locations]
[standard and raised exhaust locations]
[millenium head (rotated exhaust valve)]
Aluminum "Street or Race" 110-M Hemi
Indy Legend Hemi 426-1R
Indy Legend Hemi 426-1RA
NHRA Super Stock Aluminum modified Hemi 110-M head
NHRA Super Stock Aluminum Hemi'65 110-M head
NHRA Super Stock Iron Hemi '64-'71 559-M head
Indy 440-1 Big Block
Mopar Aluminum Magnum small block
B1-Brodix small block NHRA super stock 308/576 small block 1.88/1.78-1.60/1.50
[standard intake port or moved intake port ]
NHRA 4.900 bore spaced Pro Stock Hemi


Ford Cylinder Heads

5.00 bore Spaced IHRA Pro Stock
4.6 Modular 4-Valve & pi 2-Valve
Iron BB Cobra Jet
Aluminum Motorsport A-428 CobraJet
Iron Ex514/A460 Big Block
Iron Big Block F3TE
Iron 4-BBL Cleveland NHRA Super Stock
Iron 4-BBL Cleveland All Out Race Head
Trick Flow Small Block "R" head
Trick Flow Small Block Twisted Wedge
Edelbrock Victor Jr.
Edelbrock Victor Sr.



Chevrolet Cylinder Heads

Dart 220 [std intake runner]
Dart 220 [raised intake runner]
Dart 220 [std exh location]
Dart 220 [spread exh location]
18 Degree GM head [large and small valve spacing]
LS1 Stage 1/2 Street Heads
LS1 NHRA super stock to fit stock intake manifold
LS1 NHRA super stock raised intake runner
LS6
LT1
LT4
Dart Pro-1 small block
NHRA super stock small block 462-041 1.94/1.50
NHRA super stock big block 840 2.19/1.72
Dart Pro-1 big block Brodix Big Brodie

Pontiac Cylinder Heads

Edelbrock Performer RPM [2.19 and 2.15 intake valve / 1.66 and 1.71 exhaust]

I cant wait for your next You Tube installment on which heads were they again.......
Click to expand...
The ones that arent really covered by anyone...who's brother heads are generally exploited in incorrect ways by folks spewing misinformation on what to do with them with stone dremel tool.
I'm stepping back in where I left off years ago when I started that 318 head porting thread.
There is nothing wrong using 318/273 heads on a 318/273. They are volumed accordingly for cid and work very well...which has been somewhat of a mystery because mostly folks go for the bigger Port head. No one was around to say 'hey look what this does'..
I'm catering to that crowd....ultimately factory iron is my game.
That's why.
 
Phreakish said:
It's amazing what happens when you hog out a port, then machine the **** out of the intake side to pull the CCs back down, isn't it? That makes them no longer stock heads, too.

Might as well slap on a set of w2 heads and engrave "302" on them.

Comparing super stock and stock eliminator heads to factory casting is such a dishonest comparison that it renders you nothing more than a troll.
Click to expand...

Now this is an interesting post. So now you want to pretend those tiny 302's are W2's in size.....More dishonesty.
 
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