The little 318 & Racer Brown's quality products

gagembassett · 2024-10-04T06:45:47-0500

273 said:
Never heard anyone ever say aftermarket pistons with same rings are worth X hp over stock other than if it increases cr. You would think aftermarket would all come with the opposite offset if there was more power.

Right, but then again a lot of brands never even used the offset on their stock engines. I'd say that was more due to cost savings than anything. Maybe the same could be said about aftermarket piston brands? We all know a lot of aftermarket brands are heavily influenced by Chevy. That could entirely be a dumb statement from me, all I'm saying is it could be that it just never carried enough influence to do it. That's why I am tempted to be the test dummy and have custom pistons made for a race engine that have the offset in them

gagembassett · 2024-10-04T06:46:27-0500

pittsburghracer said:
Back in the 1980’s we were told performance stickers were worth 6 horsepower each. I had my car covered with them and the car ran like a “raped ape”. I’m thinking my black duster needs a few.

WAIT. Stickers don't add horsepower? They lied to us, those dirty bastards.

RustyRatRod · 2024-10-04T08:41:03-0500

gagembassett said:
I had not yet, I went on a vacation to Sweden then got hammered with harvest season hours for work before I can get it there. Still plan to, I would like to see 400 HP out of it. Hopefully.

I think that's a lofty goal......but life is full of lofty goals that get met everyday. It's certainly not impossible. Without dyno numbers, you never know what an engine might do. Keep us posted.

RustyRatRod · 2024-10-04T08:44:03-0500

gagembassett said:
Exactly my thought as well, had been done & sworn by for decades but the second Engine Masters said got done with their one dyno day... that nullified decades of people saying it works. That's why I don't like that show anymore and also testing should never be done with a closed mind like they had.

Well, the reason piston pins are offset is to reduce piston noise. It does that by putting the piston in an ever so slight BIND which holds the piston tighter in the direction of thrust. So it's only common sense that if you free that bind up by reversing the stock piston, you'll lose that little bit of friction. Any time you lose some friction, you know what the end result is.

Newbomb Turk · 2024-10-04T11:02:22-0500

RustyRatRod said:
Well, the reason piston pins are offset is to reduce piston noise. It does that by putting the piston in an ever so slight BIND which holds the piston tighter in the direction of thrust. So it's only common sense that if you free that bind up by reversing the stock piston, you'll lose that little bit of friction. Any time you lose some friction, you know what the end result is.

100% fact. But that friction is minimal compared to ring drag.

IMO it’s better to not use a piston with offset pins and a 5/64 ring pack and use a piston with a centered pin and at the very most a 1/16 ring pack.

The difference in friction loss between the two is significant.

Plus the engine will run cooler (less friction, less heat).

Will you see it on the gauge? Not if you run a thermostat because it regulates temperature but it reduces the amount of heat the cooling system has to reject.

gagembassett · 2024-10-04T11:32:04-0500

RustyRatRod said:
I think that's a lofty goal......but life is full of lofty goals that get met everyday. It's certainly not impossible. Without dyno numbers, you never know what an engine might do. Keep us posted.

You're right, it definitely is being pretty hopeful. I don't think it'll get there if I'm being completely honest with myself & you. Since this engine was nicknamed "Weird Science" for all of the random old school stuff I did to it i have always said I'd honestly be happy with anything from 325 to 400 HP. Keeps my spirit from getting hurt on the dyno

273 · 2024-10-04T11:42:13-0500

If your short of 400 hp doubt it will be by much, if you look a the basic 318 400 hp recipe it's 10:1, airgap, magnum heads or something on par and a 230° ish cam, your short on cr but are porting the heads.

mgoblue9798 · 2024-10-04T12:29:23-0500

gagembassett said:
I am NOT believing one mediocre dyno test, that is not how research works. Even if it doesn't work, there is ZERO reason not to do it. Even if it doesn't make any gains, it's not hurting anything to have them flipped. If it does make gains then you got free power. 3 guys on a dyno with 1 engine do not trump what Chrysler engineers said. That's just my 2 cents

Here is the poop. Stock oem pistons are offset to one side for quiet operation. Minimal gains of a couple to five hp can be had by flipping them. For a street build, it isnt worth it to me taking a chance on cracking a piston on pressed pins to flip them.

IIRC engine masters did the piston flip with aftermarket performace pistons most of which do not have the offset anyway. So nothing to gain by the flip.

mgoblue9798 · 2024-10-04T12:35:49-0500

gagembassett said:
WAIT. Stickers don't add horsepower? They lied to us, those dirty bastards.

They do. Just have to put them in the right places.

JunkyJimmy · 2024-10-04T13:15:40-0500

mgoblue9798 said:
Here is the poop. Stock oem pistons are offset to one side for quiet operation. Minimal gains of a couple to five hp can be had by flipping them. For a street build, it isnt worth it to me taking a chance on cracking a piston on pressed pins to flip them.

IIRC engine masters did the piston flip with aftermarket performace pistons most of which do not have the offset anyway. So nothing to gain by the flip.

Left them on the rods and flipped them to the other bank. Ya, not sure if it’s worth it but hey.