yellow rose
Overnight Sensation
Did you bother to read what I posted? You are arguing with Harold Bettes. An a host of others. The diameter of the piston dictates power output. Torque doesn’t move the car. Go back and read what I posted.
The "Throw Away 318"
- Thread starter Clelan
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Did you bother to read what I posted? You are arguing with Harold Bettes. An a host of others. The diameter of the piston dictates power output. Torque doesn’t move the car. Go back and read what I posted.
But that is the point. As far back as the 70's, I was swapping 675 318 heads for milled J heads. We even ran OEM cast iron 340 and 360 intakes and carbs that you could get cheap. Porting off the table to keep things simple. At that point all you needed was a cam and valve springs to go real fast. A friend was running a 318 on a dirt track. 340 heads and a cam out of North Carolina. He was easily the fastest car on the track among a sea of Fords and Chevies. Never had to lift the hood either.
Dale Davies
Well-Known Member
The diameter of the piston converts the PSI in the combustion chamber to pounds force on the piston and thus connecting rod. So a larger piston tends to produce more torque which because of the shorter stroke, can be reved higher. Horsepower is a calculated value involving torque and speed, for this RPM. Now HP in and of itself does not accelerate your car from a street light or stop sign. TORQUE does that! HP is more being done faster, so HP is what creates trap SPEED or 200MPH NASCAR lap speeds. These two values are intertwined by virtue of torque at an RPM is HP. A F1 engine creates fenominal power in a small and light package that is formidable in a car of about 1,100 pounds. From stopped they do not accelerate well, thus the 10,000RPM to just get moving out of the pits without stalling. That 800HP engine is totally usless in a 3,500 pound street car. They are all HP with a lack of torque.
Dale Davies
Well-Known Member
By the way, who is Harold Bettes? I heard of Smoky Yunick, David Vizard, Steve Dulich, Richard Holdner, but never no Harold Bettes.
Dale Davies
Well-Known Member
You have the gray matter sorted out. Run what you have or can source inexpensively. Just enjoy and hopefully have a few laughs in the mix.
@Dale Davies
The ability to have a long or short stroke engine run at a certain speed in the 1/8-1/4 or oval tracks isn’t dependent on there rpm capability.
Without a doubt more cycles created quicker will produce more power quicker. An advantageous thing not to be ignored. In the right arena.
I have found that an engines rpm capability is limited to the pocket book of the builder and not the stroke size. While there are certainly advantageous ways to build and engine for one purpose over another, I haven’t really seen a long stroke engine not be able to perform and rpm really high.
The ability to have a long or short stroke engine run at a certain speed in the 1/8-1/4 or oval tracks isn’t dependent on there rpm capability.
Without a doubt more cycles created quicker will produce more power quicker. An advantageous thing not to be ignored. In the right arena.
Harold Bettes - Google Search
Steve D is a magazine guy that has transformed into a cable TV show co-host making a living having fun on the shows he is on doing what we all would rather do, having fun with cars all day long. So, in a way, he is just like us.
Richard Holdener has a very similar history and has his YouTube channel talking about and doing what we all would love to do.
Smokey Y & David Vizard are in another class. These two fellas are out in the field on the front lines of figuring things out chasing the checkered flag.
Steve D is a magazine guy that has transformed into a cable TV show co-host making a living having fun on the shows he is on doing what we all would rather do, having fun with cars all day long. So, in a way, he is just like us.
Richard Holdener has a very similar history and has his YouTube channel talking about and doing what we all would love to do.
Smokey Y & David Vizard are in another class. These two fellas are out in the field on the front lines of figuring things out chasing the checkered flag.
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mini
Small Bore Long Stroke
Did someone say 390 stroker.... 
Dale Davies
Well-Known Member
Remember my qualifier, displacement remains constant. In roundy round racing the displacement is tightly regulated. Short track have used smaller bore/longer stroke engines to get out of the corner quicker. They also will likely use a shorter conrod for that torque advantage. A long track restrictor plate engine will use the most bore allowed and the longest rods they can fit with high CR's. It is the combination that works for the application.
You are correct with RPM capability limited by the budget. That said, a short stroke and long rods stresses parts less. F1 engines rev 18,000 RPM or more and are required to last a few races. 3L displacement with about 1.5 inch stroke.. Deck heights are short to reduce weight. The pistons use only 1 compression ring as there is no room for 2, and cost £50,000. Berylium was banned as it is creates health concerns. They made the pistons out of this for a while. Cubic money supplies required to play in that game.
Dale Davies
Well-Known Member
Newer Hemi. Some of the best head flow in the industry creates the power these produce.Did someone say 390 stroker....
yellow rose
Overnight Sensation
Horsepower is king. To dispute this is stupid (Chris Alston).
Lots of guys running more than 800 HP N/A on the street and they aren’t useless. I’ll say it again. Torque does NOT move a car. That you keep saying is positive proof you didn’t read what I posted.
Harold Bettes is in the same class as Jim McFarland, Smokey, Vizard and the rest.
@Dale Davies “Cubic money supplies ” LMAO!
How true! Also agree on how the cube inches are made are good for one arena vs another. Like the 355 CID rule. NASCAR engines displacing the same size CID differently for the track to be raced. What they use at Watkins Glenn is very different from a super speedway.
How true! Also agree on how the cube inches are made are good for one arena vs another. Like the 355 CID rule. NASCAR engines displacing the same size CID differently for the track to be raced. What they use at Watkins Glenn is very different from a super speedway.
yellow rose
Overnight Sensation
The problem is how long is a piece of string? Same with bore size. A “small” bore is ASScar is 4.155 and the rules on bore size (last time I checked) was 4.185 maximum because the GM junk can’t go bigger and the Chrysler can. In that case, the 4.200 bore (maybe 4.220 if the block sonic tested good enough) gave the Chrysler an “unfair” advantage.
Any decent engine is over square. Bore to stroke ratio matters.
This isn’t directed at you Rumble. Just trying to consolidate everything in one post and you posted last so I grabbed yours.
No worries there YR.
So what is getting my Cummins Ram 1 t. and that 30 ft loaded gooseneck moving, torque or HP!? Just wondering.
Dale Davies
Well-Known Member
Diffenent strokes for different folks as the expression goes. I agree an over square engine is better for horsepressure, but there are other factors to consider. Unless of course you head is permanently stuck up the racer *** thinking.
yellow rose
Overnight Sensation
Or, maybe your head is permanently stuck up your *** thinking torque rotates the earth. You are WRONG. By far. And yet you argue it.
Here’s what I say. Use the biggest bore you can, then set the stroke length to run the RPM you want. I gave up on 5500 RPM engines in high school. If you can’t make a valve train live at 6500 it’s time to take up putt-putt golf.
Since I’m giving you a free education, how about this? You have two 500 HP engines. One does it at 5500 RPM and the other does it at 6500 RPM. Which one gets its *** kicked every time? That’s right, the low RPM engine. Now, if you want to mentally masturbate, you can look at the BSFC numbers and I’d bet the higher RPM engine will have better BSFC numbers. Seen it way too many times.
Notice I didn’t say a damn thing about bore or stroke? Think on that for a while.
I'll take a big bore every time, easy power and way more options
yellow rose
Overnight Sensation
yea, we need to watch our blood sugar level. at least I do. lol
On your oil pressure issue, I once put a hotter cam in a 1967 318 I had put in my Duster and I only had about 10 psi oil pressure at hot idle afterward with no other changes. I think I read somewhere that the 1967 318s had a different size cam bearing on the fourth one from the front or something like that and it was just that one year block. Anyway, I ran it hard but it never blew up. I ran 50 weight Valvoline Racing oil in it.
Dartswinger70
Well-Known Member
Bret Tschacher
Well-Known Member
My first real hot rod was a 318 powered E body and I can assure you that I had many times I had to work hard to stay out of fights on account of being called a liar when either I or my younger brother raced it in street races out in south San J valley Calif. We had built quite a reputation in and around Bakersfield with that 70 Barracuda and that 318, it wasn't even bored over and I used the factory cast pistons in the rebuild. I was luck enough to get an engine that had been assembled from the factory with the heavier 360 forged rods with less than 35k miles on it from 72 to 78 when I got it. I wish I had never traded it off. Personally if it came to making a choice it would be real hard for me to decide on another 18 or 60. The one thing that would seal the deal is a forged crank for the 318. Now I could opt for a welded stroker steel crank in a 360 block. I truly love the way those 318 spin compared to a longer stroked motor.
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