AFR Heads

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B3422w5 said:
The Bloomers are 200cc
They are absolutely a fair fight against anything that isn’t offset.
As people have said, all they are is a speedmaster head with a good port.
All standard port heads were developed for stock stroke stuff. So was the offset W2 and W5 stuff.
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208cc
 
Earlie A said:
Here's what I know about the AFR head. I checked them out at a trade show a couple of months ago and took one picture. The first picture shown below is the AFR head. The reason I took the picture is because of the short turn machining. The blue arrow points to the 'cliff' that was left after the valve job. The top of the cliff is a sharp corner. No way that head is flowing 260+ without work. I was quite shocked a company would take that to a trade show for show and tell.

The AFR head is a Speedmaster casting. To my knowledge there are two foundries in China repopping the SBM head, SM and ProMaxx. The ProMaxx head comes from the Steven Sun foundry. I don't know the name of the SM/AFR foundry. I suppose there could be a third, but where would their heads be sold? Would have to be in the States.

The second picture below shows the same view as the first picture, but this time a SM head. Note there is no cliff. The cliff on the AFR could just be a core shift issue. I've experienced core shift in both the SM and the ProMaxx heads in areas other than the short turn.

The third picture shows a ProMaxx head on top of a Speedmaster head. The differences between the two castings are obvious. The exhaust port face is the quickest way to differentiate between the two castings.

Again, the AFR head is a Speedmaster casting. A bare AFR head is $130 more than a SM head and I think the SM would flow better OOTB. I see no reason to buy a (bare) AFR head. Wait for Black Friday and save another 40% on the SM.

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Kinda looks like there’s a little more material on the ProMaxx heads on that exhaust side…do they seem any heavier? Wondering if they’re chunkier
 
dusterbing the peace said:
Kinda looks like there’s a little more material on the ProMaxx heads on that exhaust side…do they seem any heavier? Wondering if they’re chunkier
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I have not weighed them. They are both Edelbrock copies. The ports are very similar. The biggest difference is the exhaust flange side. I'll try to remember to weigh them in the morning.
 
Earlie A said:
I have read several of NC Engine Builder's responses to the Bloomer head controversies and I can't see where he has said anything that puts him in the 'hater' category. I just don't think he's in the 'believer' category yet. Let's get a set of Bloomers and a good set of PBR heads in a showdown. That would sure sway me one way or the other. Just not enough info yet. A 190cc TF head developed for a 340 engine against a 208cc Bloomer is hardly a fair fight.
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when the track times prove the Bloomer heads are the real deal and he still doesn't give them any credit, that puts him in the hater category. you can dyno all day long, means nothing. Bloomers are a lot faster then Johns heads. the ET's have already been posted. track times are the finally decision maker.

MPH is the truth.
 
dusterbing the peace said:
Kinda looks like there’s a little more material on the ProMaxx heads on that exhaust side…do they seem any heavier? Wondering if they’re chunkier
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@NC Engine Builder currently has my ProMaxx 171 standard port heads and he's done a little work on them. He can elaborate more if he wants to but he made the comment that the ProMaxx intake SSR is nicer than the SpeedMaster head and he had both sitting on the table together. It didn't take too much for him to take them from 246@.550" (on his bench, which is 5-6 cfm lower than advertised) to 274@.550" with a max of 278@.600" which is where I believe he stopped. Not sure what if any difference there is on the exhaust side.
 
9secRR said:
when the track times prove the Bloomer heads are the real deal and he still doesn't give them any credit, that puts him in the hater category. you can dyno all day long, means nothing. Bloomers are a lot faster then Johns heads. the ET's have already been posted. track times are the finally decision maker.

MPH is the truth.
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Couple points to make here, I have said on more than one occasion that they SEEM to make good power. Perhaps you haven't seen me say that. The whole issue is there are only a few cars even running the bloomers, so it's hard to get a accurate comparison to what's out there. I form my opinions from EXPERIENCE, not from 3 cars and 2 guys on a car forum. Also, just a FYI, John was running 9s with his smallblocks 20+ years ago, that's common knowledge. With that being said, we will be testing various SBM heads on the dyno in the near future, and if the bloomers make more power, they will prove it for themselves. And I'll be more than happy to let everyone know how they perform. None of that is "hate"
 
B3422w5 said:
Based on track results, the Bloomer heads blow every one of these heads being discussed out of the water, easily. And in several cases, people have actually taken good Eddie heads and Trick flow heads off and swapped on Bloomers and picked up significantly, back to back.
Speaking as a person who owns a set, the casting quality is outstanding. Nicer than my eddies I had previously were
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I believe the above quote might just be true. When I tried Rod's first set out the door in 2016 or 2017, and returned them, he told me they were gonna work from scratch to make them great.
The couple conversations I had with him left me to believe him. Honest guy who seemed determined to put out a good product.
 
NC Engine Builder said:
I allready mentioned a few times in other threads, the "AFR" head appears to be just a re-branded speedmaster, but people dont listen.
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Sorry buddy. I read the first bit of this and moved directly to the post window.

B3422w5 said:
The Bloomers are 200cc
They are absolutely a fair fight against anything that isn’t offset.
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I disagree. It’s not a fair fight at all. I don’t care if they are the same casting. The port work on cc amount shows more work went into the head than the other. Thus a more developed port against a less developed port.

I know you love these heads and Mr. Bloomer. But don’t blow smoke up everyone’s *** and expect to be believed. Seriously, your statement is a joke.
 
rumblefish360 said:
Sorry buddy. I read the first bit of this and moved directly to the post window.



I disagree. It’s not a fair fight at all. I don’t care if they are the same casting. The port work on cc amount shows more work went into the head than the other. Thus a more developed port against a less developed port.

I know you love these heads and Mr. Bloomer. But don’t blow smoke up everyone’s *** and expect to be believed. Seriously, your statement is a joke.
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So it’s not a fair fight because he did better port work than others?
That’s the most stupid thing I have read on here, and that’s saying something.
 
B3422w5 said:
So it’s not a fair fight because he did better port work than others?
That’s the most stupid thing I have read on here, and that’s saying something.
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No you have read stupider and the most recent o e is the reply quoted above.

Don’t be a moron.
 
Ironmike said:
I believe the above quote might just be true. When I tried Rod's first set out the door in 2016 or 2017, and returned them, he told me they were gonna work from scratch to make them great.
The couple conversations I had with him left me to believe him. Honest guy who seemed determined to put out a good product
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You don’t have to take anybody’s word because plenty of people have posted time slips and combinations on here who actually go down the track with them. It removes all doubt.
 
rumblefish360 said:
No you have read stupider and the most recent o e is the reply quoted above.

Don’t be a moron.
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You’re the moron. What’s unfair about a better mousetrap. Rod and Vic started with the exact same hunk of aluminum many others have.
The fact they got provably better results doesn’t make it “ unfair” it just makes them better.
 
B3422w5 said:
You’re the moron. What’s unfair about a better mousetrap. Rod and Vic started with the exact same hunk of aluminum many others have.
The fact they got provably better results doesn’t make it “ unfair” it just makes them better.
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No, you’re the moron and you can’t read and understand what was written. What I said disagreed and agreed with you at the same time.

Stupid ***!

I’d try and re write it to a more basic level so you can understand but I’m not to good with crayons and mentally short blind eyed idiots like yourself.

Seriously speaking, your an idiot.

Go back and re read what I wrote about 20 times and take a month or two off and ponder what’s written before returning and failing at insulting me and the forum.

Good day sir!
 
rumblefish360 said:
No, you’re the moron and you can’t read and understand what was written. What I said disagreed and agreed with you at the same time.

Stupid ***!

I’d try and re write it to a more basic level so you can understand but I’m not to good with crayons and mentally short blind eyed idiots like yourself.

Seriously speaking, your an idiot.

Go back and re read what I wrote about 20 times and take a month or two off and ponder what’s written before returning and failing at insulting me and the forum.

Good day sir!
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Not insulting the forum at all. I read exactly what you moronically wrote. You should talk about insulting people. Nobody on here is more moody and all over the place posting than you.
You’re dumb enough to attack a head as unfair because somebody put more work into it and got better results than anybody else.
You seriously should think about what you are saying
Do you think when Charlie Westcott got into SS/AH and started kicking everybody's *** and having a tenth on them it was unfair because he was smarter and out worked everybody. Uh, no.
All started with the same hunk of metal to whittle on
 
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SM, Edelbrocks, AFR's are not ported, ain't suppose to be on the same league there just suppose to be a step above stock, (Basically instead of running/rebuilding/modding stock heads use one of these) Even TF and CNC SM are just a slight step up from that, not meant to be low 10-8 second heads.

You would need to generally compare them to other 600+ hp heads out there.
 
273 said:
SM, Edelbrocks, AFR's are not ported, ain't suppose to be on the same league there just suppose to be a step above stock, (Basically instead of running/rebuilding/modding stock heads use one of these) Even TF and CNC SM are just a slight step up from that, not meant to be low 10-8 second heads.

You would need to generally compare them to other 600+ hp heads out there.
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The upcoming dyno test will be comparing them to other ported edelbrock knockoff heads. If they are better, we will find out.
 
NC Engine Builder said:
Couple points to make here, I have said on more than one occasion that they SEEM to make good power. Perhaps you haven't seen me say that. The whole issue is there are only a few cars even running the bloomers, so it's hard to get an accurate comparison to what's out there. I form my opinions from EXPERIENCE, not from 3 cars and 2 guys on a car forum. Also, just a FYI, John was running 9s with his smallblocks 20+ years ago, that's common knowledge. With that being said, we will be testing various SBM heads on the dyno in the near future, and if the bloomers make more power, they will prove it for themselves. And I'll be more than happy to let everyone know how they perform. None of that is "hate"
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I shouldn’t have said the word hate, my bad.

I know what John was running and I also run well into the 9’s with a lot less.
 
273 said:
SM, Edelbrocks, AFR's are not ported, ain't suppose to be on the same league there just suppose to be a step above stock, (Basically instead of running/rebuilding/modding stock heads use one of these) Even TF and CNC SM are just a slight step up from that, not meant to be low 10-8 second heads.

You would need to generally compare them to other 600+ hp heads out there.
Click to expand...

I took edelbrocks off my car that had been ported by a local guy, then gone over and ported more by a shop that has won enginemasters type competitions and is a well known Mopar shop. The shop that did the small block Victor heads on the 376 cube 360 that’s been posted on here numerous times.
I took them off, swapped to bloomers and new headers and picked up half a second and better than 8 mph. Same cam, convertor, carb, gears , etc, etc.
 
rumblefish360 said:
I disagree. It’s not a fair fight at all. I don’t care if they are the same casting. The port work on cc amount shows more work went into the head than the other. Thus a more developed port against a less developed port.
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Same casting so how isn’t it fair?
 
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