NC Engine Builder
Grumpy Old Man
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AFR Heads
- Thread starter skrews
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Newbomb Turk
Well-Known Member
LMAO, no, it’s going to be a slaughter comparing a stock port to Bloomer port. Suggesting anything else is crazy. How do y’all keep missing this?
Looking forward to your head being tested.
Since you have stopped in, tell everyone how to order your head.
Psssst, he really is in love with you!
Cause they could be for different applications. It's like comparing a TF 240 vs 270 obviously the 270 gonna flow better and make more power but there meant for different applications not exactly a fair comparison. You got to compare them each against similar competitors.
B3422w5
Well-Known Member
Very bad analogy. The trick flow 240 and 270 are actually different castings. Not the same head.
The Bloomer head is the same casting as all these other knockoff Chinese castings.
It’s just that Bloomer did a better Job getting the head to flow better than other CNC programs have done with them.
It would be like having Hughes fully port an Eddie head, then complain it osnt fair if somebody else fully ported it, and it didn’t work as well as the Hughes did, then complaining Hughes is unfair because it’s faster.
There is nothing unique about the Bloomer head over any other speedmaster type head you can get and have ported, other than the skill of who is doing it.
I have no clue why people don’t get that
Can you give me the thread title so I can search for it?
NC Engine Builder
Grumpy Old Man
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What does it matter what the casting was, point was application.
But I've yet to see you compare it to other fully ported heads. That's the point.
So far TF 190 is the best flowing head I've heard you compare it to, and obviously TF aren't sold as a low 10 - 9's second head, so I wouldn't say there in the same bracket.
B3422w5
Well-Known Member
I am comparing to any of this family of Edelbrock copy head. They are all basically the same head. You can buy the “ shocker” cnc ported head, a company called Toth takes these heads and cnc ports them and sells them( or did) Hughes offers a fully ported stage 3 Edelbrock head, they even offer a “ big mouth” Eddie head that has the pushrod moved over, etc, etc, there are others too.
You do know that the Bloomers are just CNC ported as well, right.
They are CNC’ed at Bischoff’s( BES) get the valve job done there, then Rod assembles them with your spring choice. Same basic thing all these other CNC heads have done, including trick flows.
They are CNC ported, then trick flow sets up the springs per your choice, roller, flat tappet, hydraulic, etc.
Regards the AFR heads, they are just an Eddie knockoff like all these others, and from what I understand, have not been CNC ported.
Maybe where the misunderstanding is, only some of these heads have been CNC ported, and offered that way. I listed a number of them above
B3422w5
Well-Known Member
Great question
B3422w5
Well-Known Member
Oh, I thought you wanted to buy fully prepped Bloomer heads, fully done.
I’m the grand scheme of things, the aftermarket isn’t going to be willing to develop a head and intake combination for an LA Mopar that’s on par with LS flow numbers. There too much to overcome within the confines of the stock design for them to ever come out on. I’d personally be happy with a true open chamber and a W2 exhaust port option on what’s available. Realistically, what are you looking at to raise the intake port and adding enough short side to make it truly capable of feeding 4 inch or longer strokes? I speculate that the valve cover rails would have to be an inch higher to meet that end.
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You can, most people probably don't, application price availability.
You keep on comparing go carts to a Nascar because they both have 4 wheels instead of comparing to other Nascars. Who cares the Nascar can beat a go cart.
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Oldiron440
Well-Known Member
Over the last year AFR has come out with a cheaper line of heads that’s cast overseas (china) and assembled by them and I’m assuming these are part of that line of heads.
If I remember correctly I saw a video where they compared the new AFR to a Pro Max head and the casting is very similar, what I can’t remember is if it was a sbf or sbc head.
I guess my point is making heads is like making oil filters were they change the paint and label and then they are making a different brand. There’s a foundry in china making head castings just changing the label and then you have a different brand.
If I remember correctly I saw a video where they compared the new AFR to a Pro Max head and the casting is very similar, what I can’t remember is if it was a sbf or sbc head.
I guess my point is making heads is like making oil filters were they change the paint and label and then they are making a different brand. There’s a foundry in china making head castings just changing the label and then you have a different brand.
Normally speaking, to improve the head. But I often question this route and wonder why people don’t purchase the better head to begin with. They often site it’s to much head for the job which I seldomly find is true unless it’s a ridiculous over kill but would love to see somebody try a full ported head on a stock or near stock engine.
As in, when is a cylinder head to big?
Often enough, a well prepped head like Mr. Bloomers or Trickflows are seen as too expensive, but yet people will purchase the lesser head to have ported.
I was telling Dantheman that I was purchasing heads that are more inline of my target goals and the Bloomer, Trickflows & Victors were not yet out. The only other option at the time were the Indy or W9.
I don’t know if they would be overkill in a realistic every day driver of 360, 400-450 hp, but it would be an interesting and expensive experiment.
Oh, also, sometimes the price of porting that starts with correcting any said cylinder head is t on the fore front of people’s minds with the added expense taken into consideration. The price of any work varies regionally, shop to shop.
Then the customer gets asked if they want to have more work done they forget/fail to consider like a valve job, valve work, upgraded valves, changing of the spring package. This failure of communication Or forethought leads to an extra expense people miss.
What I like about Mr. Bloomer and other good places is the question ls are asked upfront. (A minor assumption there but I have faith)
Then the customer gets asked if they want to have more work done they forget/fail to consider like a valve job, valve work, upgraded valves, changing of the spring package. This failure of communication Or forethought leads to an extra expense people miss.
What I like about Mr. Bloomer and other good places is the question ls are asked upfront. (A minor assumption there but I have faith)
It's pretty bad when Americans are dickering over Chinese heads.
Worse yet is an American company like AFR putting their stamp on them.
Worse yet is an American company like AFR putting their stamp on them.
Welcome to reality.....
John told me the trick flow heads were very inconsistent. He had a set on the shelf and 1 port flowed as advertised on the intake side.
Oldiron440
Well-Known Member
As far as an American company putting their name on them I think it’s more of a need to than a want to. There’s so many cheap heads out there that in many cases it’s hard to justify spending the big money on a quality product that costs many times more than the knock offs.
Me personally I’d rather keep my ported 915s and 452s on my big blocks than run china heads. There’s power in the original cast iron especially if camed correctly. But the best part is listening to the jiffy heads tell me I need aluminum heads to go that fast… lol
NC Engine Builder
Grumpy Old Man
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What I am saying is yes they are a speedmaster casting. They have a port job developed by rod and vic bloomer, that is unique to there heads. There are some impressive numbers associated with these, and they very well MAY be the best non offset rocker head currently available. They are also assembled with quality parts, by hand.
Well, I am just getting started reading this thread I figured this is something I need to understand.
CYA =
.thank you, just starting to read this thread and ge an education . Thank you.
Thank you.. i need time to read and understand everything I see,
Thank you
I have a set along with a set of ported Edelbrocks.
Its an acronym for "Cover Your ***".
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