72smallairparticler
Well-Known Member
No decking unless it comes up later. Didnt talk about it
72 duster resto
- Thread starter 72smallairparticler
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junkyardhero
Well-Known Member
talk to the machine shop and tell them your expectations, they may recommend a piston that will meet your criteria. or they might say that you're on your own!
you *need* to communicate with the machine shop. this is KEY. remember, bore finish is important to what rings you're going to run, which goes hand in hand with what pistons you use. also, *some* head gaskets require a specific finish on the block and heads to seal properly.
if you drop it off and just tell them to pop it to "whatever over" till it's clean and do the usual stuff then you're taking a gamble on what you get back. and if you don't know for sure what the criticals are, then you can't really order parts with confidence or assemble.
i mean, you can... if you're just doing production work and you're fine with whatever the outcome is.
RAMM
Well-Known Member
Decking an LA is an absolute must. It is more important than a line hone (if youre not dealing with a spun bearing). Ma Mopar left the decks so absurdly tall and random and crooked it is a machining travesty. Skip the line hone and deck it to zero with these Mahle pistons/rings... These are the best value on the market bar none. Have your machine shop set the piston to wall clearance at the recommended values--these pistons don't rock much. Oh and they are superlight. J.R.
https://www.us.mahle.com/media/usa/motorsports/sbm-flat-top-webpage-3.pdf
P.S. Enjoy the free 10-15hp your 360 makes with their fabulous 1mm/1mm Napier / 2mm oil ring package. When assembling you should be able to turn the crank with your hand with 4 pistons in. Compressing the rings can be a little tricky, take your time.
72smallairparticler
Well-Known Member
Sounds good fellas, appreciate the input. Ill make the ask for sure. We are communicating - plan was simply to find out what bore is required before ordering the pistons. Then calculate piston selection, aftermarket head selection to meet the compression goals as affordable as I can go.
Seems like I could snag speed master assembled aluminum heads for about 400 more than required to rebuild these stock smog heads.
I need to probably sell off most if not all the standard bore rebuild kit I pieced together from rock auto .
Seems like I could snag speed master assembled aluminum heads for about 400 more than required to rebuild these stock smog heads.
I need to probably sell off most if not all the standard bore rebuild kit I pieced together from rock auto .
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72smallairparticler
Well-Known Member
Maybe this is a dumb question but when selecting a set of lifters to run with a new cam, is there a "best" approach? Seems like the quality of HFT aftermarket lifters has taken a nosedive so I'm sort of leaning toward the combo of Howards streetforce 2 with lifters. Assuming those work with my stock pushrods. I'm not making any pre-mature orders til I do more homework but just wondering if I buy JUST the cam, if there are better brands for lifters.
junkyardhero
Well-Known Member
if the cam i'm buying offers a matching lifter kit, i'll usually go that direction. in the case of howard's i *think* their lifters are made my morel, which are good quality.
you're not going to know if the stock pushrods work with the setup until you start your pre-assembly checks. likelihood is that they will, it's a pretty much stock build, but you always have to check-- especially with aftermarket heads.
you're fine to buy a cam and lifter kit. if you need different push rods it is what it is, the cam and lifters probably weren't the contributing factor-- the machine work and heads would be.
you're not going to know if the stock pushrods work with the setup until you start your pre-assembly checks. likelihood is that they will, it's a pretty much stock build, but you always have to check-- especially with aftermarket heads.
you're fine to buy a cam and lifter kit. if you need different push rods it is what it is, the cam and lifters probably weren't the contributing factor-- the machine work and heads would be.
72smallairparticler
Well-Known Member
@junkyardhero how many engines have you built man? I can totally see how this becomes addicting now lol
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junkyardhero
Well-Known Member
more than most, fewer than many
it's not about the motors we built, or dreamed about, or blew up and had to rebuild; but about the lessons we learned along the way.
junkyardhero
Well-Known Member
JR, thank you for articulating what i was trying to say and had in my mind and totally forgot about.
the rec on those pistons is gold. great ring pack (and material!) and the fact that they're forged is a great plus! lightweight just sweetens the deal.
72smallairparticler
Well-Known Member
Got a chance to get the grill painted today. The bullitt anthracite wheels on the car will go well with the charcoal paint used on the grill to freshen things up. Have some fun ideas on the rest of the paint combinations in the engine bay that should turn out pretty nice
72Duster440
Well-Known Member
I just put a cam in my 440, I used one of Comps kits for all of the parts. Break in went fine and so far I have 20 miles on it.
72smallairparticler
Well-Known Member
If you had the choice between some ported iron heads or the speedMaster aluminum non ported heads which would you choose?
Price point is about the same
Price point is about the same
DionR
Well-Known Member
Personally, I would always go aluminum unless I was looking for a restoration look or competing in something that had rules that required iron. If for no other reason, they weight half as much.
junkyardhero
Well-Known Member
i'd always steer toward alum aftermarket heads if the price was the same or close.
but! brand new heads still need to be checked out, they're rarely ready to run OOTB... which means a trip to the machine shop and mas dinero. and then tack on some more coin if you need to update springs/locks/keepers blah blah blah.
now if the ported iron heads are rock and roll ready to snap on and run: hardened seats, the springs match the cam you want to run, good valves that are cut proper, good guides, fresh seals, and so on and so forth... that may sway my decision.
if the speedos are some take offs that were already run and somebody already did all that, and they weren't rode hard and put away wet then that's the play there.
72smallairparticler
Well-Known Member
[FOR SALE] - SB 360/340/318 Heads ready to bolt on and go...
I have a few sets of SB 360/340/318 heads that are completely machined and ready to bolt on and go... They are 360 castings years range typically from 73 - 77, they will perform better than any stock 340 X or J head... Ported with hardened exhaust seats, new 2.02" intake valves, new 1.60"...
www.forabodiesonly.com
These are the iron heads been chatting with KrazyKuda about them. He says they're put together by a professional and I think they'd pair well with my Howards Street Force 2 cam.
I hear good things about the ProMAXX aluminum heads which come fully assembled at about $1800 ready to go.
72smallairparticler
Well-Known Member
Sold off my purple cam today for $40 - time for a burrito.
72smallairparticler
Well-Known Member
I'm sure im not the only one whose run across a really good deal on a motor while building a motor, but I am now stuck overthinking things. Found a killer deal on a 408 stroker, freshly rebuilt. The remainder of my current build will cost the same, but will only yield me a refreshed 360 stock bottom end, higher compression aluminum heads and a modern profile street cam.
Ordered my 2.5" Exhaust pipes, mufflers and some correct headers but half the parts on backorder now. Other headers I had picked up in the initial deal were meant for fenderwell installs on early barracudas - but at least they'll cover the cost of the new ones, provided I can sell them.
Hoping to have more updates on the car soon - machine shop is taking their sweet *** time which is probably why I am itching to pull the trigger on the stroker and just put the car back together and enjoy it this summer...
Also have a new foster child in our home, all my other 3 kids soon will be out of school for summer, work is picking up, side business is also buzzing, and it's mothers day this weekend followed by my wifes' birthday next week soooooo..... odds are I won't be getting to the garage soon.
Ordered my 2.5" Exhaust pipes, mufflers and some correct headers but half the parts on backorder now. Other headers I had picked up in the initial deal were meant for fenderwell installs on early barracudas - but at least they'll cover the cost of the new ones, provided I can sell them.
Hoping to have more updates on the car soon - machine shop is taking their sweet *** time which is probably why I am itching to pull the trigger on the stroker and just put the car back together and enjoy it this summer...
Also have a new foster child in our home, all my other 3 kids soon will be out of school for summer, work is picking up, side business is also buzzing, and it's mothers day this weekend followed by my wifes' birthday next week soooooo..... odds are I won't be getting to the garage soon.
junkyardhero
Well-Known Member
tough call. depends on how deep you're into the 360 for and if you can at least break even on it and score out the 408.
even if you're a little more dough in, the 408 is worth it and the instant gratification/speed running the project timeline might justify the additional cash outlay.
even if you're a little more dough in, the 408 is worth it and the instant gratification/speed running the project timeline might justify the additional cash outlay.
SeaDuster
Member
Better late than never. Per @RAMM , my 340 block decks were both out of square with the crank AND different heights. If you haven't already, you'll have spent money wisely squaring up and zero-decking your block for your chosen piston combo. (I went with Ross pistons, and Eagle crank and rods.)
As for heads, you can't go wrong with the CNC'd TFS heads. I had to do a lot of work to my Edelbrocks to get them to pull to 7k and might have more money into them than an out-of-the-box sets of TFS's. BTW don't overlook valvetrain geometry. It's an issue.
As for heads, you can't go wrong with the CNC'd TFS heads. I had to do a lot of work to my Edelbrocks to get them to pull to 7k and might have more money into them than an out-of-the-box sets of TFS's. BTW don't overlook valvetrain geometry. It's an issue.
72smallairparticler
Well-Known Member
Stroker 408 motor opportunity was too scammy to follow through on. Was gonna be a 90 minute drive and the guy didn't seem like he wanted to sell it. Hardly any communication and no phone number to connect and talk through the deal.
So, back to my build. Machine shop still hasn't done the work. It's been 5 weeks since drop-off.
So I'm just doing what I can at home for the time being. Cutting out old exhaust from the slant 6. Got new headers painted black. New dual chamber mufflers arrived as well so might paint those black as well while I wait for the 2.5" pipe kit to arrive.
Going to drop the tank next chance I get so I can get it out of the way for the rear end swap and new tank/sending unit that have to go in. Also need to cut out the tire sump in the trunk that rusted out and weld in the replacement sheetmetal I have. Any suggestions on painting / coating the inside of the trunk and underside. Do you guys typically use undercoating or just shoot it with paint. It's a CA car so, not much need for undercoat protection from road salts etc.
Pulled the factory steering wheel off to get the aftermarket one on with an extension but realized I got the wrong column size (2") and need a 3" to do it right.
Ended up getting a solid deal on a Lunati 703 cam that'll be going in the block. It's about the right RPM range for my build and think it'll be a great matchup with the 750 carb, air gap intake and the 2300 stall converter (B&M) and the 3:73 gears. Also connecting with immengines.com on some assembled speedmaster heads.
Junk yard diving next weekend for 8.8 brake brackets, hoses and calipers and then ordering 2 new rotors so I can get the shortened explorer rear end finished up. It'll be tough to keep myself from relocating the leaf springs in while it's all out....but we'll see how it goes.
So, back to my build. Machine shop still hasn't done the work. It's been 5 weeks since drop-off.
So I'm just doing what I can at home for the time being. Cutting out old exhaust from the slant 6. Got new headers painted black. New dual chamber mufflers arrived as well so might paint those black as well while I wait for the 2.5" pipe kit to arrive. Going to drop the tank next chance I get so I can get it out of the way for the rear end swap and new tank/sending unit that have to go in. Also need to cut out the tire sump in the trunk that rusted out and weld in the replacement sheetmetal I have. Any suggestions on painting / coating the inside of the trunk and underside. Do you guys typically use undercoating or just shoot it with paint. It's a CA car so, not much need for undercoat protection from road salts etc.
Pulled the factory steering wheel off to get the aftermarket one on with an extension but realized I got the wrong column size (2") and need a 3" to do it right.
Ended up getting a solid deal on a Lunati 703 cam that'll be going in the block. It's about the right RPM range for my build and think it'll be a great matchup with the 750 carb, air gap intake and the 2300 stall converter (B&M) and the 3:73 gears. Also connecting with immengines.com on some assembled speedmaster heads.
Junk yard diving next weekend for 8.8 brake brackets, hoses and calipers and then ordering 2 new rotors so I can get the shortened explorer rear end finished up. It'll be tough to keep myself from relocating the leaf springs in while it's all out....but we'll see how it goes.
72smallairparticler
Well-Known Member
Alright.
So I must have selected the worst machinist in the bay area. This guy Gary at Champion machine shop in campbell is the worst. 7 weeks hes had my block. Quoted me ten days. Third week in I call and hes like youre next in line. Because 10 days is what he estimated. So ok 5th week. Oh youre second in line now ill call you end of week. No call. Today was week 7. Hes got an $800 deposit, my block, my crank, my heads… At this point im just pissed. I want my money and my Engine.
Going to his shop tomorrow to get this resolved
So I must have selected the worst machinist in the bay area. This guy Gary at Champion machine shop in campbell is the worst. 7 weeks hes had my block. Quoted me ten days. Third week in I call and hes like youre next in line. Because 10 days is what he estimated. So ok 5th week. Oh youre second in line now ill call you end of week. No call. Today was week 7. Hes got an $800 deposit, my block, my crank, my heads… At this point im just pissed. I want my money and my Engine.
Going to his shop tomorrow to get this resolved
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junkyardhero
Well-Known Member
man, that sucks.
i know it's hard but try and go in with a positive attitude and work toward a solution. getting puffed up and name calling don't do nobody no good, and if somebody feels badgered into the work they might do a quick-n-dirty half *** job just to get somebody off their sack.
you're kinda in a fucko situation, if you wanna just grab your stuff and he's started on it you'll need to square up the tab which is an odd place to be. but there's also the consideration that a lot of machine shops don't like sloppy seconds. and if they will take the work in, expect to pay again for *waves hand vaugely* this or that or whatever.
but on the other hand, if he hasn't done nuthin' on nuthin' then get your money, scoop your **** and split. if he's just like, tanked and mag'd the parts then i'd pay for that and truck my junk elsewhere.
sorry you're having to go thru this and let us know how it turns out.
i know it's hard but try and go in with a positive attitude and work toward a solution. getting puffed up and name calling don't do nobody no good, and if somebody feels badgered into the work they might do a quick-n-dirty half *** job just to get somebody off their sack.
you're kinda in a fucko situation, if you wanna just grab your stuff and he's started on it you'll need to square up the tab which is an odd place to be. but there's also the consideration that a lot of machine shops don't like sloppy seconds. and if they will take the work in, expect to pay again for *waves hand vaugely* this or that or whatever.
but on the other hand, if he hasn't done nuthin' on nuthin' then get your money, scoop your **** and split. if he's just like, tanked and mag'd the parts then i'd pay for that and truck my junk elsewhere.
sorry you're having to go thru this and let us know how it turns out.
72smallairparticler
Well-Known Member
Well I called him again yesterday and got him on the phone finally. I politely asked whats up with the work. He said the block is on the machine now and looks like it'll clean up at .020 over. He didn't address the wait time, but I just asked what the turnaround was going to be for the rest of the work. Bought KB 107s and they're on the way. He said once the pistons are weighed / balanced then he'll know if he needs to mag and balance the crank...???? Seemed weird to me. He's still going to remove/install cam bearings and turn the crank but supposedly 2 day turnaround if he "needs to balance and mag" the crank. At least the thing is getting worked on finally, but likely I wont make it to any shows this summer.
Camshaft I ordered was on backorder from Lunati/Edelbrock so currently waiting in JEGS service chat line at number 76 in line to cancel the order lol. So I called Edelbrock directly (and got someone on the phone in <3 minutes) and they said they're completely canceling the whole camshaft line so my order should have been cancelled not backordered. Soooo back to the hunt for the right cam.
Meanwhile, I'm doing what i can on the rest of the car. This week I got:
- mufflers
- exhaust pipe kit
- correct motor mounts
- rotors, backing plates, calipers and pads for the 8.8 - this will likely be my main focus this week.
Plan is to build out the 8.8, drop the 7.25 and the fuel tank while it's out. Then once I have the 8.8 in place I can accurately route my exhaust pipes.
I'll probably drop the pistons off next week to keep machinist going and hopefully get the bottom end pretty much done by end of month if im lucky.
It certainly is worth it to take a breath away from things when getting heated about things not going your way
Camshaft I ordered was on backorder from Lunati/Edelbrock so currently waiting in JEGS service chat line at number 76 in line to cancel the order lol. So I called Edelbrock directly (and got someone on the phone in <3 minutes) and they said they're completely canceling the whole camshaft line so my order should have been cancelled not backordered. Soooo back to the hunt for the right cam.
Meanwhile, I'm doing what i can on the rest of the car. This week I got:
- mufflers
- exhaust pipe kit
- correct motor mounts
- rotors, backing plates, calipers and pads for the 8.8 - this will likely be my main focus this week.
Plan is to build out the 8.8, drop the 7.25 and the fuel tank while it's out. Then once I have the 8.8 in place I can accurately route my exhaust pipes.
I'll probably drop the pistons off next week to keep machinist going and hopefully get the bottom end pretty much done by end of month if im lucky.
It certainly is worth it to take a breath away from things when getting heated about things not going your way
Glad to hear progress is being made, albeit slower than you hoped!
junkyardhero
Well-Known Member
repeat the mantra: it always takes longer than i thought
anyway, happy that cooler heads prevailed. sucks about the cam tho. keep on top of the machine shop, when you drop off the pistons take in donuts. sometimes that'll help kick a project to the front of the line.
anyway, happy that cooler heads prevailed. sucks about the cam tho. keep on top of the machine shop, when you drop off the pistons take in donuts. sometimes that'll help kick a project to the front of the line.
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