AFR Heads

[Mean416]

I'd be willing to pay $3000-$3500 for a set of complete heads that run standard rockers intakes and headers, that could flow 300+ CFM at a .600 lift range. That would still account t for the mopar tax, and allow afr to make some money. I'm not alone in this.

I was kinda hoping blueprint would take this up but it became clear it's going to be a TF competitor at best.

I honestly want nothing to do with old iron heads. It's cool stuff, bit not for me.

 

[Newbomb Turk]

I wasn't calling out w2's for being leakers. But w5s are.

I was calling out w2's for being cast iron.

Love w2's. But they ain't modern head by any stretch. And they require a lot of special parts to make work.

PLUS...you still gotta port the snot outta them to get big power.

WTF? Not modern? Very few “modern” heads won’t touch it. A TF won’t and it’s “modern”.

And you said W series heads leak and now you’re walking it back.

You don’t have ******* clue about cylinder heads.

 

[Mean416]

Have you ever had a set ported? I highly doubt you have. So again no experience.

Trick flows do not make great power, show me an example please.

I'm done arguing with you. You know what? Actually you're 100% correct.

Do you FEEL better now? You guys who always gotta be right I swear annoying AF.

 

[Newbomb Turk]

I'd be willing to pay $3000-$3500 for a set of complete heads that run standard rockers intakes and headers, that could flow 300+ CFM at a .600 lift range. That would still account t for the mopar tax, and allow afr to make some money. I'm not alone in this.

I was kinda hoping blueprint would take this up but it became clear it's going to be a TF competitor at best.

I honestly want nothing to do with old iron heads. It's cool stuff, bit not for me.

Your hard on for a flow number shows how far out of your lane you are.

Just stop.

 

[Mean416]

I'd call mid 10s out of a head making 280cfm good power. I'm sure people would agree with that.

 

[Newbomb Turk]

I'm done arguing with you. You know what? Actually you're 100% correct.

Do you FEEL better now? You guys who always gotta be right I swear annoying AF.

What’s annoying is guys with no ******* clue popping off about **** they have no clue about.

 

[9secRR]

I'm done arguing with you. You know what? Actually you're 100% correct.

Do you FEEL better now? You guys who always gotta be right I swear annoying AF.

no argument from me, just like the facts not bullshit

I'd call mid 10s out of a head making 280cfm good power. I'm sure people would agree with that.

Those heads you are talking about were sent out for more porting since OOTB they were not fast enough.

What’s annoying is guys with no ******* clue popping off about **** they have no clue about.

This tends to be the norm now a days.

 

[9secRR]

Your hard on for a flow number shows how far out of your lane you are.

Just stop.

Exactly, It’s not all about the flow #’s. My W2’s prove that.

 

[fishmens67]

Those heads you are talking about were sent out for more porting since OOTB they were not good enough.

Boosted was running mid 10's before he sent them off, his ultimate goal was 9's and he fell short.
I 'm looking forward to see what the new owner put's down for a number when he get's it back together.

 

[9secRR]

Boosted was running mid 10's before he sent them off, his ultimate goal was 9's and he fell short.
I 'm looking forward to see what the new owner put's down for a number when he get's it back together.

Think he ended up with 10.23 @ 130

I’m hoping the new owner hits 9’s.

 

[skrews]

Would love to see an offset rocker version of the Bloomer head, but I guess that isn't going to happen.

 

[Mean416]

Would love to see an offset rocker version of the Bloomer head, but I guess that isn't going to happen.

They're basically ported eddies so you could make it happen if you wanted to. But I doubt there's big gains to be had. Would require other things to be worked on and I'd bet those heads are pretty close to maxed out already

 

[273]

never looked on mopar forums before? W2’s are for sale all the time and cheap.

Average guy? What makes an average guy?

I don't get why you don't get the concept of average.

What aftermaket heads did the majority used for there builds last year, what heads are they more than likely gonna use this year ?

Do you think W Indy Victor etc.. are beating Edelbrock rpm and clones, TF etc.. in use ?

 

[Newbomb Turk]

I don't get why you don't get the concept of average.

What aftermaket heads did the majority used for there builds last year, what heads are they more than likely gonna use this year ?

Do you think W Indy Victor etc.. are beating Edelbrock rpm and clones, TF etc.. in use ?

They don’t get used because of this thread.

Dudes will not buy the heads. When the W2 head came out every non retard Chevy engine builder was looking to fit them to a Chevy, or copy them.

Go look at what Chad Spierer does. His fast **** is W2 shape.

Average is not the term.

I’ve said it for decades. Chrysler guys suck hind tit because of themselves.

Who in their right mind would design and build a cylinder to make power when you know, you know for a FACT 99.5% of bubble gummer Chrysler guys won’t buy the **** no matter how good it is. That’s just the hard truth.

If you think the W2 is exotic you need to get out more. It’s basic ****.

 

[fishmens67]

I don't get why you don't get the concept of average

I already told you what average was 350- 375 honest hp for 85% of the small block guys. 10% for an honest 450hp
and 5% for 450 and above.

 

[273]

They don’t get used because of this thread.

Dudes will not buy the heads. When the W2 head came out every non retard Chevy engine builder was looking to fit them to a Chevy, or copy them.

Go look at what Chad Spierer does. His fast **** is W2 shape.

Average is not the term.

I’ve said it for decades. Chrysler guys suck hind tit because of themselves.

Who in their right mind would design and build a cylinder to make power when you know, you know for a FACT 99.5% of bubble gummer Chrysler guys won’t buy the **** no matter how good it is. That’s just the hard truth.

If you think the W2 is exotic you need to get out more. It’s basic ****.

No ones arguing that W type heads aren't better.

The point was, before TF's the average guy had ootb Edelbrocks to make high 400 hp power then TF allowed them to make 500+ hp now if some made like a mass produced 330 cfm version then the average dude could step it up to 600 hp with ootb heads.

Not say the heads shouldn't be checked or there's not better alternatives etc.. but most average guys are stuck at TF level right now.

That was the point nothing more.

 

[Mean416]

No ones arguing that W type heads aren't better.

The point was, before TF's the average guy had ootb Edelbrocks to make high 400 hp power then TF allowed them to make 500+ hp now if some made like a mass produced like a 330 cfm version then the average dude could step it up to 600 hp with ootb heads.

Not say the heads shouldn't be checked or there's not better alternatives etc.. but most average guys are stuck at TF level right now.

That was the point nothing more.

You said something that triggered someone and they're never gonna back down and try to see the point....least of all publicly acknowledge it.

The good thing is for every one of us posting there are several just lurking and everyone with actual critical thinking skills can make their own conclusions.

 

[Newbomb Turk]

You said something that triggered someone and they're never gonna back down and try to see the point....least of all publicly acknowledge it.

The good thing is for every one of us posting there are several just lurking and everyone with actual critical thinking skills can make their own conclusions.

We can’t see what point? That you don’t know jack **** about the nonsense you are posting.
Get over yourself. You need to develop thinking skill first. Once you master that you can start thinking critically.

 

[fishmens67]

average dude

Is happy making an honest 400 hp , honestly. lol
This 500 hp figure you keep throwing around is out of reach for the average guy, it's the same as the Chevy guy's claiming 600 and only really having about 350 hp. lol
An honest 450 hp will propel 3300#'s low 11's, certainly not your average dude.

 

[273]

Is happy making an honest 400 hp , honestly. lol
This 500 hp figure you keep throwing around is out of reach for the average guy, it's the same as the Chevy guy's claiming 600 and only really having about 350 hp. lol
An honest 450 hp will propel 3300#'s low 11's, certainly not your average dude.

I remade my point here

No ones arguing that W type heads aren't better.

The point was, before TF's the average guy had ootb Edelbrocks to make high 400 hp power then TF allowed them to make 500+ hp now if some made like a mass produced 330 cfm version then the average dude could step it up to 600 hp with ootb heads.

Not say the heads shouldn't be checked or there's not better alternatives etc.. but most average guys are stuck at TF level right now.

That was the point nothing more.

 

[Hysteric]

W heads are known to leak. They do require a lot of porting. They do require offset rocker gear and custom stuff such as headers. Is this incorrect?

Don't forget manifold. I can't help but notice they all seem to have the same chamber with very little variance except the Bloomer but that may be due to the CNC work.

 

[Mean416]

My main point - and I think - most people's gripe, is that there's no real performance heads beyond the TFs and edelbrocks, that have a reasonably low barriers to entry. I don't think anyone is expecting it to be as cheap as a SBC. That's not reasonable. What I mean by this:

1. Should have 600 HP NA capabilities and good for supporting strokers
2. Aluminium
3. Readily available, not swap meet and wanted ads stuff
4. Be reliable for usability on the street. Paper thin port walls can be problematic
5. Should not require being sent out again to a professional porter to achieve good flows. (Sure, nice to have as an option if you want more but shouldn't be a requirement)
6. At least takes a standard header pattern without weird adapters
7. In my opinion, it's would be nice if a standard intake would work but if it required a specific intake supplied by the manufacturer that'd be OK.

I think, with this, the "average guy" with a decent stroker bottom end could easily crack 600 HP with nothing more than an appropriate cam selection. It's really not that big a stretch dudes.

 

[92b]

My main point - and I think - most people's gripe, is that there's no real performance heads beyond the TFs and edelbrocks, that have a reasonably low barriers to entry. I don't think anyone is expecting it to be as cheap as a SBC. That's not reasonable. What I mean by this:

1. Should have 600 HP NA capabilities and good for supporting strokers
2. Aluminium
3. Readily available, not swap meet and wanted ads stuff
4. Be reliable for usability on the street. Paper thin port walls can be problematic
5. Should not require being sent out again to a professional porter to achieve good flows. (Sure, nice to have as an option if you want more but shouldn't be a requirement)
6. At least takes a standard header pattern without weird adapters
7. In my opinion, it's would be nice if a standard intake would work but if it required a specific intake supplied by the manufacturer that'd be OK.

I think, with this, the "average guy" with a decent stroker bottom end could easily crack 600 HP with nothing more than an appropriate cam selection. It's really not that big a stretch dudes.

Which of the criteria (1-7) do the bloomers not meet?

 

[273]

Which of the criteria (1-7) do the bloomers not meet?

Mass Production, People knowing about them and or where to buy them.

TF aren't better than ported Edelbrock's or clones, it's ease of availability and price and name brand is why they sale, the average guy can order them from almost anywhere and bolt them on without to much trouble and know they can make 500+ hp.

 

[Mean416]

Which of the criteria (1-7) do the bloomers not meet?

3.