blue missile
Well-Known Member
no the tire hits the frame at about -5* to full lock, I dont know what to do about it for now.
Birth of the Blue Missile
- Thread starter blue missile
- Start date
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blue missile
Well-Known Member
Yes because of width, other than that there is lots of room and depending on the height of the bump stop that limits the upward movement I wont need to raise the inner fenders.
I suppose I can, brain is mush after wrestling with other issues, come to think of it there is plenty of thread in the control arms.
Off to play the blues and relieve some stress, Ill take another look at it tomorrow.
Andrew
I suppose I can, brain is mush after wrestling with other issues, come to think of it there is plenty of thread in the control arms.
Off to play the blues and relieve some stress, Ill take another look at it tomorrow.
Andrew
HemiMark
Well-Known Member
I think you got thrown down a flight of steps in a bundle of laundry when you were small.
Several times..and a few trips down the laundry shute
set the car as low as you can get it, within the shock specs, then use the appropriate size bump stop.
#9.9102G is a Energy Suspension low profile that measures appx 5/8" thick and you can always sand/grind some off the tip of it for the perfect thickness
blue missile
Well-Known Member
Denny,
when I setup the upper arms does race= forward and street=back of centerline?
Andrew
when I setup the upper arms does race= forward and street=back of centerline?
Andrew
positive caster is measured BEHIND the axle centerline
Street ....3* positve
Drag race.....6* positive
the more you tilt the spindle back (positive caster) the better the high speed stability....and forward, closer to centerline, the easier it will turn at slow speeds.
Street ....3* positve
Drag race.....6* positive
the more you tilt the spindle back (positive caster) the better the high speed stability....and forward, closer to centerline, the easier it will turn at slow speeds.
Old Man Mopar
Righteous Dude
There was no laundry.
blue missile
Well-Known Member
And there was no chute!
In the mean time, building this car really is a lesson on how to shove 7lbs of Dung (a bible word) in a 3 lb box.
Yes at full lock there will be tie rod issues. I currently have 1/8": clearance, see pic. However perhaps spacing the steering box further back would eliminate that. The frame rail will have to be channeled with a piece of tubing to allow these tires to rotate any further. By my measurements no more than 3/4" and full lock can be had.
If I push the tires out any further then I involve the fender lip.
The final pic is the 1/8" clearance for the caliper from the rim. With the supplied spacers, its 1/4" off center towards the center of the car. My plan is to make a 3/16" aluminum spacer the exact shape as the back of the inner brake pad. The caliper will stay off center but the pads will have an equal throw to the rotor.
And so it goes.
Im up for suggestions.
Andrew
In the mean time, building this car really is a lesson on how to shove 7lbs of Dung (a bible word) in a 3 lb box.
Yes at full lock there will be tie rod issues. I currently have 1/8": clearance, see pic. However perhaps spacing the steering box further back would eliminate that. The frame rail will have to be channeled with a piece of tubing to allow these tires to rotate any further. By my measurements no more than 3/4" and full lock can be had.
If I push the tires out any further then I involve the fender lip.
The final pic is the 1/8" clearance for the caliper from the rim. With the supplied spacers, its 1/4" off center towards the center of the car. My plan is to make a 3/16" aluminum spacer the exact shape as the back of the inner brake pad. The caliper will stay off center but the pads will have an equal throw to the rotor.
And so it goes.
Im up for suggestions.
Andrew
what size rim do you have on there? and what backspacing? I'm miffed because Ross's 17" w/5.25" backspacing cleared..lock to lock...and you have a larger diameter rim???
Wilwood has a shim/spacer shaped like their brake pad...I saw them at the Jegs site when I was looking for shims to center up my caliper on the rotor, those shims were suppose to be in the kit(?)
a regular tie rod end will give you additional clearance from the rim. I use the FatMan Fab extended ends to keep the tie rod parrallel with the lower control arm thereby eliminating bumpsteer. By using the shorter (std) tie rod end you may encounter a slight bit of bumpsteer...but minimal and maybe worth the tradeoff (we are talking less than 1/2" diff in lenght)
you could easily space the rack rearward as long as it does not run into your oil sump
Wilwood has a shim/spacer shaped like their brake pad...I saw them at the Jegs site when I was looking for shims to center up my caliper on the rotor, those shims were suppose to be in the kit(?)
a regular tie rod end will give you additional clearance from the rim. I use the FatMan Fab extended ends to keep the tie rod parrallel with the lower control arm thereby eliminating bumpsteer. By using the shorter (std) tie rod end you may encounter a slight bit of bumpsteer...but minimal and maybe worth the tradeoff (we are talking less than 1/2" diff in lenght)
you could easily space the rack rearward as long as it does not run into your oil sump
blue missile
Well-Known Member
17"x5.75", the larger back space is the big difference, if the rim were 1/2" further out it would work. the kit had 1/64"self adhesive shims.
Look Denny dont be miffed, if there is one thing I have learned about this build is that it has taken twice the work of a normal build. How exactly will bump steer affect the driving and handling of the car especially if its minor?
Andrew
Look Denny dont be miffed, if there is one thing I have learned about this build is that it has taken twice the work of a normal build. How exactly will bump steer affect the driving and handling of the car especially if its minor?
Andrew
as the suspension goes up and down....IF the tie rod and lower control arm are at different arcs...the tires/ wheels toe in and out. Ideally you want them parrallel, and traveling in similiar arcs
the basic problem when building front steer with the rear steer componets, the arcs are soooo far off that it makes it dangerous. as the front rises on acceleration and drops upon braking...the front wheels are moving (toeing) in and out. It makes the car feel like it is dancing in the front. Most stock set-ups are probably off a 1/2'' or more. That is what made the drag racers that really knew what they were doing in the 60's FAST. they figured out that if the wheels stayed straight...the car goes fast. They would heat the steering arms up and bend them to get the least amount of bumpsteer as possible.
I will mock up and measure the bumpsteer difference between the two tie rod ends (I have both) on my next mock up...within a couple of weeks
the basic problem when building front steer with the rear steer componets, the arcs are soooo far off that it makes it dangerous. as the front rises on acceleration and drops upon braking...the front wheels are moving (toeing) in and out. It makes the car feel like it is dancing in the front. Most stock set-ups are probably off a 1/2'' or more. That is what made the drag racers that really knew what they were doing in the 60's FAST. they figured out that if the wheels stayed straight...the car goes fast. They would heat the steering arms up and bend them to get the least amount of bumpsteer as possible.
I will mock up and measure the bumpsteer difference between the two tie rod ends (I have both) on my next mock up...within a couple of weeks
blue missile
Well-Known Member
OK Denny, when I installed the power steering rack the bushings were too long for the rack so I cut them down. This moved the rack 1/2" forward, I corrected that with washers and now I have a solid 1/4" clearance for the tie-rod, at the point when the tire hits the frame. Im fine with letting in a piece of pipe to create the clearance for the tire,
Andrew
Andrew
Old Man Mopar
Righteous Dude
1/8" there is just fine. This clearance will not shrink. You could barely get a business
card between the rims and calipers on my Porsche when it was stock.
blue missile
Well-Known Member
the ones that came with it. I was told that it did not come with bushings so I ordered a set as well.
By the way both packages arrived tonight.
Andrew
By the way both packages arrived tonight.
Andrew
excellant.
blue missile
Well-Known Member
Got the caliper offset issue resolved with a 3/16" aluminum spacer, now the throw to the rotor is equal. Next, the no space for the tire at full lock issue.
Andrew
Andrew
76orangewagon
Well-Known Member
Looking good Andrew, I'm sure you'll figure all the little issues out.
blue missile
Well-Known Member
Got the steering linkage set up, Ill weld it when the motor is test fitted.
Denny,
is this where the upper shock mounts are supposed to go? If so Ive screwed up. there is only 3/4" of upper travel to the 5/8" bumpstop and no downward travel the shock is at full extension. Its 13.5" fully extended, 12" ride height which was what I thought I was supposed to get. Where did I go wrong?
Andrew
Denny,
is this where the upper shock mounts are supposed to go? If so Ive screwed up. there is only 3/4" of upper travel to the 5/8" bumpstop and no downward travel the shock is at full extension. Its 13.5" fully extended, 12" ride height which was what I thought I was supposed to get. Where did I go wrong?
Andrew
Take the shock out
Remove the bump stops
with a wheel/tire on the front...set the car at your desired ride height using a jack(s) to hold up the front. when I did mine I used a junkyard sizzor jack on each side to get it even
measure the shock distance.....eye to eye....I sent you two upper shock tower/ supports (one is 1" shorter than the other) additionally each one is adjustable - shorter up to 1/2" Try to get the eye to eye...at ride height....11.75" to 12". Naturally, since the lower is set (non adjustable), the adjustment needs to be made with the different upper shock mounts. Fine tuning comes with the shock ...later
When in mock up...I only install the shock to check clearance issues.
I run an adjustable strut (11.75- 12") in the meantime to keep the ride height constant...since all the weight is not on the car.
The spring size (lb) and adjustment will be made once all of the weight is on it,
until then, if you use the coilover, you spend a lot of time unneccassarily adjusting without the actual finished weight of the front
Remove the bump stops
with a wheel/tire on the front...set the car at your desired ride height using a jack(s) to hold up the front. when I did mine I used a junkyard sizzor jack on each side to get it even
measure the shock distance.....eye to eye....I sent you two upper shock tower/ supports (one is 1" shorter than the other) additionally each one is adjustable - shorter up to 1/2" Try to get the eye to eye...at ride height....11.75" to 12". Naturally, since the lower is set (non adjustable), the adjustment needs to be made with the different upper shock mounts. Fine tuning comes with the shock ...later
When in mock up...I only install the shock to check clearance issues.
I run an adjustable strut (11.75- 12") in the meantime to keep the ride height constant...since all the weight is not on the car.
The spring size (lb) and adjustment will be made once all of the weight is on it,
until then, if you use the coilover, you spend a lot of time unneccassarily adjusting without the actual finished weight of the front
from the picture it looks like you have the upper support in for a taller ride height...try the shorter set....it will lower the front ride height 1"
leave the bump stops off for now....we can cover them once you get it sitting the way you like it
leave the bump stops off for now....we can cover them once you get it sitting the way you like it
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