Holley/Demon Carb stumble

-
I use PB blaster to remove old gaskets. It works.
I also believe if you start with junk you end up with junk.
Buy the new blocks, I like spending money. even if it is yours.
 
The question is still do i buy adj metering block and try to make them a match to the stock 3310 metering block or just buy another (new) 3310 metering block(134-131)?????
EDIT: i can by one(1) 134-131 for 80 dollars or two adj metering blocks for 110 bucks
 
What's the difference and how do you tell the difference between a two channel, and a three channel metering block???????
 
I use Superformance gaskets and nothing else. Virtually everything else is usable at best and most of it is junk. You'll never scrape a SF gasket.

You are now getting to the point where you could have bought two billet blocks and been done. I'd use BLP or Braswell or damBest long before I bought anything that said Holley on it. In fact, I'd use ProForm blocks before Holley.
 
yellow rose said:
I use Superformance gaskets and nothing else. Virtually everything else is usable at best and most of it is junk. You'll never scrape a SF gasket.

You are now getting to the point where you could have bought two billet blocks and been done. I'd use BLP or Braswell or damBest long before I bought anything that said Holley on it. In fact, I'd use ProForm blocks before Holley.
Click to expand...

dAMBEST is too dAM expensive. I'm not, trying to be a Pro Stock driver!!!!!!1600 dollars for 4 float bowls and floats WOW!!!!
And they only showed one carb. Looked fun if i had a 1500 Cubic Inch MOUNTAIN Motor
BLP and Braswell i'm swimming in part# just like i an on Ebay with ProForm Metering blocks. 3 emulsion or 5. standard cal or race. one says it for a 3310 and another says it for a 1850,3310, 6778,6779 and i didn't recognise the last part number.
another one says it for a 4150,4160 and 2300 series...........
 
Cudafever said:
dAMBEST is too dAM expensive. I'm not, trying to be a Pro Stock driver!!!!!!1600 dollars for 4 float bowls and floats WOW!!!!
And they only showed one carb. Looked fun if i had a 1500 Cubic Inch MOUNTAIN Motor
BLP and Braswell i'm swimming in part# just like i an on Ebay with ProForm Metering blocks. 3 emulsion or 5. standard cal or race. one says it for a 3310 and another says it for a 1850,3310, 6778,6779 and i didn't recognise the last part number.
another one says it for a 4150,4160 and 2300 series...........
Click to expand...


Jon (damBest) makes some cool stuff, but he is on the expensive side. I think his main bodies are the schizznizzle. I've been thinking about dropping the 1k for a carb he has. Explaining that to the old ball and chain is going to be a tough battle. That's why I haven't done it yet. Some ridiculously small Venturi that flows 900 CFM. But I digress. He also has some really good tech DVD's that aren't expensive.

BLP is BLP.com.

Braswell is braswell-com.3dcartstores.com.

Not sure on the ProForm. I've never seen anything other than 4 emulsion blocks from them.

You're probably better off to call BLP or Braswell and see what they say. My carb uses the 5124 series blocks but I bought a complete BX4 carb.
 
Ok, had to go look and see for myself. The only difference I can see between the ProForm blocks is the standard calibration block has the port for timed vacuum advance and three emulsion holes. There is nothing wrong with that. Make sure the 1-3 holes have a .026-.028 bleed and block the number 2 hole and go. Always check to see the size of the bleed holes in the block. I've seen some as big as .034 and PF says not so. I have the blocks to prove it. So they can bite me.

The other block doesn't have a timed vacuum port and 4 emulsion holes. Same thing as above...1-3 get .026-.028 bleeds and 2-4 get blocked.

As to the idle feed restriction, PF has them in the high position in the block. I've spent more time screwing around lowering mine and my engine HATES the lower IFR position. Drives all the carb gurus nuts because they say the science is settled. So that would be one more thing to tune. If you can't clean the idle up, lower the IFR's. You probably have to tap the lower holes but that's easy.

Either of those blocks will work.
 
Cudafever said:
so i still have the problem of the brass restrictor in the bottom on one and in the top on the other. how is this going to affect the install?
Click to expand...
Is there a restrictor in the top of that one? I don't see it clearly in the photo. If you say its there, then I'm sure it is.

I might try running it as is. High IFR on the secondaries doesn't get my panties up in wad. If it has trouble getting on the secondaries, then take it out and put the IFR in lower position.
If there's nothing there, then squirt something in the hole and see how fast it comes out the bottom. Like I mentioned before, there's a chance the IFR is presed in under the cap.

Since there's no vacuum port on this block, it came was either a secondary or from some other carb (not the 3310).

Only thing I don't know is if the enlarged angle channel? could cause issues. Is it enlarged or just faced?
Cudafever said:
BLP and Braswell i'm swimming in part# just like i an on Ebay with ProForm Metering blocks. 3 emulsion or 5. standard cal or race. one says it for a 3310 and another says it for a 1850,3310, 6778,6779 and i didn't recognise the last part number.
another one says it for a 4150,4160 and 2300 series...........
Click to expand...
If you're looking at used blocks, post up some links. Can tell a lot by looking oif the photos are good.

yellow rose said:
BLP is BLP.com.
Click to expand...
Yep.
IMO BLP is your best choice if your want billet. Have them set you up with a block tapped for both high and low IFR.
Then all you need is to drill set screws or can use what they offer. Won't need to tap blocks or press in bleeds.
BLP even has (or had) some press in bleeds if you ask.
Reminds me I need to order some...
 
First off thank everyone for the help.

Mattex
Is the "angle channel" #24.... right? If so, they are the same size on both blocks.
As well as the high or low hole were the IFR is NOT pressed in.
The IFR (pressed in brass insert) in the high/top is .061" esh the lower or bottom (3310) is .054" esh.
Is this right? do they need to be a larger size when there in the top compared to bottom..........or should the size be the same top or bottom.....?
 
Cudafever said:
First off thank everyone for the help.

Mattex
Is the "angle channel" #24.... right? If so, they are the same size on both blocks as well as the high or low hole were the IFR is NOT pressed in.
The IFR (pressed in brass insert) in the high/top is .061" esh the lower or bottom (3310) is .054" esh.
Is this right? do they need to be a larger size when there in the top compared to bottom..........or should the size be the same top or bottom.....?
Click to expand...
Honestly 12 pages on a carburetor stumble?
At some point you would be thinking in the back of your head that you've given the internet plenty of time to get this sorted out.
I would be strongly thinking about looking for someone in your local area who rebuilds carburetors and having a long discussion with them...
 
j par said:
Honestly 12 pages on a carburetor stumble?
At some point you would be thinking in the back of your head that you've given the internet plenty of time to get this sorted out.
I would be strongly thinking about looking for someone in your local area who rebuilds carburetors and having a long discussion with them...
Click to expand...



He better off sending it to Thumpr carbs or doing what he's doing, which is learning for himself.
 
j par said:
Honestly 12 pages on a carburetor stumble?
At some point you would be thinking in the back of your head that you've given the internet plenty of time to get this sorted out.
I would be strongly thinking about looking for someone in your local area who rebuilds carburetors and having a long discussion with them...
Click to expand...
How many time have you sent something out to be fixed because you didn't want to mess with it. just to have to fix it yourself in the end.
There is NO "carb shop" with in 200 miles of me. And a carb rebuild shop has enough smarts to clean and install new gasket. GUESS WHAT! I still have the same problem and it's just a cleaned passage carb now NOT WHAT MY PROBLEM IS! Yes i could just by that 1000 dollar carb.....and then, would STILL need to tune it. Just like you, i don't have a big wad of cash to throw at a problem, so i spend more money, a little at a time, and learn something. And with the help of this forum. I'm doing just that.
Thank you Everyone!!!!
 
Cudafever said:
How many time have you sent something out to be fixed because you didn't want to mess with it. just to have to fix it yourself in the end.
There is NO "carb shop" with in 200 miles of me. And a carb rebuild shop has enough smarts to clean and install new gasket. GUESS WHAT! I still have the same problem and it's just a cleaned passage carb now NOT WHAT MY PROBLEM IS! Yes i could just by that 1000 dollar carb.....and then, would STILL need to tune it. Just like you, i don't have a big wad of cash to throw at a problem, so i spend more money, a little at a time, and learn something. And with the help of this forum. I'm doing just that.
Thank you Everyone!!!!
Click to expand...
Hold on a minute! You're quoting me and going off on someone else about spending $1, 000 on a carburetor?
I certainly did not recommend spending $1, 000 on a carburetor. I was just hoping that there was a carburetor shop closer than 200 miles that you could actually talk to a person instead of Internet Heroes getting you to pull pepper out of poop...
I'll tell you why I prefer my Edelbrock...
It has two main Jets two secondary Jets two metering rods two Springs and 2 air bleed screws...
I've read this entire thread and I still don't have a clue of what you guys are talking about....
If I was spending $1, 000 I would have you send to Summit for a dual quad tunnel ram for $500 and buy two nice rebuilt Edelbrock for 250 each. LOL...
 
j par said:
Hold on a minute! You're quoting me and going off on someone else about spending $1, 000 on a carburetor?
I certainly did not recommend spending $1, 000 on a carburetor. I was just hoping that there was a carburetor shop closer than 200 miles that you could actually talk to a person instead of Internet Heroes getting you to pull pepper out of poop...
I'll tell you why I prefer my Edelbrock...
It has two main Jets two secondary Jets two metering rods two Springs and 2 air bleed screws...
I've read this entire thread and I still don't have a clue of what you guys are talking about....
If I was spending $1, 000 I would have you send to Summit for a dual quad tunnel ram for $500 and buy two nice rebuilt Edelbrock for 250 each. LOL...
Click to expand...
:lol:
 
Cudafever said:
Is the "angle channel" #24.... right? If so, they are the same size on both blocks.
Click to expand...
upload_2019-8-11_11-51-16.png


and some blocks have a horizontal connection. You can still call it an angle channel. The horizontal channel reduces sloshing and doesn't need a siphon break.
upload_2019-8-11_12-19-17.png


Cudafever said:
As well as the high or low hole were the IFR is NOT pressed in.
The IFR (pressed in brass insert) in the high/top is .061" esh the lower or bottom (3310) is .054" esh.
Is this right? do they need to be a larger size when there in the top compared to bottom..........or should the size be the same top or bottom.....?
Click to expand...
No. too large.
 
ok it official! this block is just not going to work.
Yup the bottom of that angle channel is WAY Bigger than the 3310.
 
Mattax said:
No. too large.
Click to expand...
Too large regardless whether its top, bottom or middle.
Some say submerged location can be a little smaller if everything else is the same.
The logic is submerged restricts the flow of solid fuel (liquid). Mark W has mentioned its real. I've just moved them and can't show you a direct comparison without any other variables.

IMO 0.035" dia is about as large as it ought to be. Maybe .037 in some cases, especially if high, but I wouldn't start that large. IIRC .031 or .033 was primary on the 3310-1, 2, 3s and IFRs were around .076
Wish I had an unmolested 4780 or something close to what you have there to look at, but I don't.
I think there was an older Holley 4150 dp that had downlegs on all 4 but don't remember the number, nor did I ever actually own one. Would have to ask one of the guys with notes on lots of different carbs.
 
Cudafever said:
ok it official! this block is just not going to work.
Yup the bottom of that angle channel is WAY Bigger than the 3310.
Click to expand...
I'm can't say if that will make a difference. The channel was never a restriction. The question is whether making it larger than the other passages causes problems - like inconsistances due to turbulance. Ask someone whose played with that stuff. Dominic (thumper) or the guy YR knows.
You can also do a search through RFS forum without joining. I know its come up there. Most are humble and share what we know and ask lots of questions. Don't let that fool ya. Mark W won the carb shootout a couple years ago. Mike Laws was part of BLP, Deep Roots and several others are serious carb builders for racing and restoration...
 
the Idle Fuel Restrictor on the 3310 is not 76. as i said above its .054", give or take a few thou. have only standard drill bit to measure them as my others have not showed up yet
 
Cudafever said:
the Idle Fuel Restrictor on the 3310 is not 76. as i said above its .054", give or take a few thou. have only standard drill bit to measure them as my others have not showed up yet
Click to expand...
That was a mistype. Sorry. .076 for Idle Air Bleed.
 
FWIW Here's measurements from the primary side of a 3310-2 I bought a couple years ago.
upload_2019-8-11_13-20-25.png


and here's measurements from someone else, from a 3310-1:
upload_2019-8-11_13-14-7.png


and the restrictions in the -1 I have on long term loan is .033 IFR and .078 IAB. That matches what others have found so its probably unaltered in that respect.
 
Ahh ok the idle air bleed up in the main body not the idle fuel restrictor in the bottom or top of the metering block.
My proform main body came with a 73 or a .073" front and back.

So if i buy a replacement 3310 metering block or some billet block, it won't be here for the next race.
So new throttle base plate is going on, rear jet extensions and float are going on. Then, try and tune it from there to get threw this next race.
As i take it apart i will be documenting everything as we have talked about. Number of turns on throttle idle screws, what size holes are in the BG/Demon Metering block, fuel jets, how many emosion holes in block and what ones are plugged and what size the open ones are. Excetra
hope that the new base throttle blade plate fixes my problem and i don't have to even think about metering blocks again.....(Post #76)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
-

Back
Top